1) You're assuming that you're charging the same amount from 110V to 220V. If you have commuting/driving patterns where you come home, but can charge a bit before going back out, that can add up to much less gasoline burned. From that standpoint, a 220V charger can make a big difference. Otherwise, you're right, 110V is fine.

2) I know a couple people that have two car seats in the back at all times. I suspect you'll be all set with one. You can always put the other seat down for cargo space if need be.

3) You should use Premium, that's what the car recommends. The cost savings of a lower fuel would be washed out by the lower performance of the engine using that lower octane. Use Premium.

You'll likely love your Volt, the large majority certainly do!

 

We switched our electricity billing to hourly so we could quickly charge in the middle of the night using lower rates. The savings does add up over time but I don't know if we've recovered the cost of installing the 220v charger yet. :/

Given the small amount of gas used, we just stick to premium, filling up once every 2-3 weeks.

 

You will fall in love with the Volt, so plan on getting a Clipper Creek Seriously, most of us, myself included don't really purchase a 240 volt charger to save money, we purchase it so we can simply charge the car faster, from empty in 4 hours instead of all night or 10 hours. This way you drive more on the EV side of the car. Some don't need that extra juice, but I have found it great and well worth the extra expense for the added convenience.

A car seat shouldn't be a problem; however, I haven't needed one as my kids have been in booster seats since I have had it. Simply stop at a dealership and put a car seat in. Then you can see and judge for yourself.

You will have no problem putting a stroller in the back of the car if you mean the hatchback part. It has plenty of room.

We have discussed in detail the grade of gas. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. The Volt was designed to run on premium gas. That is really what you should put in it.

Good luck

 

1. I have no plans on installing a L2 220v
2. ...? Will there be enough room to get a stroller in the back also?

3. I heard of people using Mid-Grade gas instead of Premium can this work? ... If so what are the issues I might have could this damage the car?

If I can think of any more questions I will be back!

Thanks again

Mike

about the charger-is this a question or are you telling us? There are other advantages to having a 220V charger, I only charge on 120V: at home at night, I get a full charge, and at work during the day, I get a full charge over 9 1/2 hours. I think that the 220V charge is about 5% more native efficient that the 120V charge, Partly because of reduced time with the temperature management system pumps running, partly because of reduced I2R losses (half as much).

On weekends, I occasionally have about 5-30 extra miles of Extended range running because I am in and out all day. As you say, why spend $1000 to save 40 miles a month of Extended range a month... It does provide extra range in the dead of winter here in New England because the it recovers part of the pre-heat consumption. If you buy a plug in Clipper creek model, you can likely sell it when you release the car at the end of the lease. I know I would buy one if someone here were looking to sell...

as for rear seat space- this is like Mark Twain's reported death- a greatly exagerated non-problem. I'm 6'4" an occasionally sit in back behind one of my teenagers. though more often the 2 teens will sit in the back. we have no problems with this, though if I'm driving, I pull my seat forward a bit to allow more leg room behind.

you have to test out the stroller in the hatch, there is a fair amount of room there, but I've seen some pretty massive strollers these days,

(what are they thinking- we always wanted the lightest, smallest umbrella stroller we could find- some of these high end strollers are bigger than a "smart for 2"????)

Only you can judge if less than recommended octane is good for you. the engine will adjust itself to reduce knock, so you don't hear or feel it, but it is there, and you have reduced engine efficiency... is that trade off worth it for you? only you can answer that. There are no reports of blown crank bearings or cracked heads or cylinder wall oil leakage that I have seen, but that doesn't mean that they aren't coming, just that most of us put premium in. In 7500 miles, I've only filled the tank 3 times, for $30.00 each (sept 7, December 13, Jan 20...) so the savings to drop to lower octane would be pretty small... too small to convince me to enter the world of being an engineering test driver... Do you ever buy gas in Denver and drive east? then think about altitude octane effects...

Electric rates are different from state to state, so get advice from someone in your home state- In MA I pay $0.18/khw now, on a TOU Plan, I would pay $0.30 peak and $0.12 off peak, and I would not save, but in states where the generation charges are also TOU, there can be significant savings.

 

You will not save a dime with a 220v charger; it is a great convenience though. Instead of remembering to set the car to charge at 12 Amps when you turn it off, digging out the 110v charger plugging it in and attaching it to the car, just pull up in the garage and plug it in. I use my 110v at work, just kind of a pain comparatively. The Bosch charger at the house was only $423 from Amazon, worth every penny for the convenience.

 

1. As far as cost savings go, unless you can get a very good off peak rate, you won't be saving anything with an L2 EVSE. I use L1 at home and don't have any problems after over 2 years. The case wear you may save money is if you can get a quick charge after work, before you go out somewhere. You may offset some gas usage that way.
I would recommend that you keep the EVSE plugged in all the time so you don't wear out your outlet. Outlets aren't really designed to have things plugged in and out repeatedly every day, they will wear out eventually.

2. I have heard with the seat all the way back, you can't fit a rear facing seat, but I don't have kids, so not sure. There is plenty of room in the trunk to put a stroller.

3. It is recommended that you use 91 octane fuel. Many people have reported that 87 Octane (regular) decreases the efficiency, which you would expect. I wouldn't expect it to do any damage though. With the small amount of gas you actually use, you might as well spend the extra couple cents for premium.

 

Feels like I'm just echoing the words of the other posters...

1. 220V EVSE is not a requirement. I only charge on the 110 that came with the car. There are times I wish I had a L2 charger just so I can go gas free more often. To me, this isn't about saving money, but more about not using a nasty fuel (environmental, political, et al). You have at least 1 kid...so maybe, like me, you don't want him/her growing up in a wasteland.

2. I have 2 kids, so I have a booster and baby carseat in at all times. I can quickly and easily take both out and fit them in the rear hatch whenever I need to fit adults in the back. Totally doable. Some carseats are bigger/bulkier than others, so I'd suggest on your next test drive, bringing your seat along and putting it in to see how it fits. Stroller will fit pretty easily, too. Like I said, I am able to put both carseats in the back if needed.

If you only have 1 carseat to put in, I'd recommend putting it behind the passenger seat so that you can sit more comfortably. I'm 5'8" and would like to push the seat back just a tad more, but the carseat blocks it. Not uncomfortable, but could be more comfy.

3. Premium gas is 15 to 30 cents more than Midgrade... I'm cheap as hell, and even I splurge and just go with Premium since I fill up so irregularly (3 times in 8500 miles). But, if you really, really, really wanna buy Midgrade, go for it. It seems the true (imho) reason Premium is recommended is fear of Reg gas going stale with limited use. If your commute is such that you will be filling up often, I don't think Reg/Midgrade would be harmful.

 

In regards to the smart meter. Where I live the switchover was free. If you had a smart meter some utilities offer an EV Time of Use plan where you can charge at low rates during off peak hours. This could be a significant savings if you charge at higher tier rates. If you are like most Volt drivers, most of your driving will be on electricity, so lowering your electricity rates will have a significant impact on your operating costs.

I don't believe using regular grade gas will save you any money. GM's chief powertrain engineer has stated that doing so results in a 10-15% reduction in fuel economy.

 

You will not save that much money on charging from 110v to a 220v it's the same price your just doubling the amount of voltage that is running through.

Actually.. The Utility charges you by the KWh, which is a compound of both Volts and Amps. The Ohms law for that is P=I*E, or Power (in Watts) equals Current (I in amps) times Voltage (E in volts). Point being: You use "more", you pay more. Period. Just resolve it into what they charge you for, Kilo Watts used over an Hour.

So: it has been observed that charging at 240V is 6 hours faster (DON'T underestimate that value to your driving experience BTW) then a 10 hour 120V charge. As far as charging the batteries go it uses basically the same amount of juice (do your maths). However during charging the battery pack will heat up (just like your cell phone) and the BTMS will kick on to cool the pack. This means the air conditioning is running enough to keep the batteries at a good temp. Running it on-and-off for 4 hours uses less energy than running it on-and-off for 10 hours. Search for threads on this, you use measurably less juice overall charging at 240V!

Will the difference make up for the price of an installed Clipper Creek? Over the life of the car, charging fully every day.. maybe not. It's not a big savings. But it is there. To most of us it is about convenience. I hope that helps!

Also, just buy the right gas. Letting GM out of the engine warranty over $50/yr(rounding way up?) sounds kind of expensive.

I love my Volt, and am using less gas every quarter than the last. You get a little "addicted" to driving 100% EV, I'm never going back if I can help it.

 

Answer:

1. Once you get a 240V 30A or 40A EVSE installed, you'll find it very convenience to run errands back and forth throughout the day since it charges "faster." Plus, you will need it in the future if you want to electric again.

2. You can fit a car seat. Wouldn't recommend using the infant seat adapter since the room in the back is not the same as an SUV backseat. But, you can use it. However, the infant car seat will no move much. Yes, you can fit a stroller, just not the bulky type stroller. If it's a toddler seat, it'll safe comfortable.

3. Use premium gas. It's like only 10 or 20 cents more. And, you won't fill up that often. Plus, I made long trips on my Prius (formerly owned), the cost difference to fill up the Prius versus the Volt on the same miles is only about 2-3 dollars more on the Volt. That's all. And, it will run much more efficient with Premium anyway.

 

My wife and I both have Volts and I can confirm that car seats are no problem (we've had a Peg Perego infant car seat with base, Max Cosi Convertible car seats and Britax frontier SICT boosters in the Volt at various times).

Strollers are no problem. Peg Perego Aria double stroller fits the hatch almost perfectly when folded and the Bob revolution single will fit folded as will the Bob revolution double stroller folded (with the two quick release wheels taken off and the front wheel angled up fitting in the space between the two rear seats).

I've always used premium - we use such little gas that didn't make sense for us to go with a lower grade.

Good luck!

 

My gas useage dropped signifigantly when I had the Bosch PowerMax L2 charger installed. The 120 just could not charge fast enough. My daily round trip commute is 36 miles and consumes the full range of the battery. If I get home from work car is on the charger for 2 hours and have to drive 3 miles to the store and back Im probably going to be using gas. Also having to select the higher charging rate every time you plug in gets annoying, and if you forget, you might not have a full charge when you leave again.

 

I know there's a ton of Volt fans on this site, so I feel compelled to chime in with my 2 cents. My Volt is not two years old and has been in the shop over 12 times, from the leather seat backs falling off to the electric heater burning out, LCD screens going blank, TPMS sensors failing, strong exhaust fumes in the cabin, and a host of other problems too numerous to mention in a single post. I've been unhappy with my Volt in most regards, and in the short time I've owned it, the car has been in the shop more than any other car I've ever owned. Personally I'm going back to gasoline import or a diesel after this experience. Maybe a Nissan, if they produce something better looking than the Leaf.

 

Sorry to hear that you suffered problems while others have not. Every product that is mass manufactured will be expected to have at least one product that will fall apart. In this case, your Volt.

The saying also goes, a "lightning will not strike the same spot twice." Hopefully, if you decide to get back into a Volt, maybe Gen 2, you won't experience these issues.

 

My advise: DON'T BUY A VOLT.

 

L2 vs L1 - The value of L2 depends upon how you use the Volt. I only have the L1 that came with the Volt. I have not purchased an L2 and I already have 220 in the garage for power tools. Living in Phoenix we get 50 miles (plus or minus a few) year round on a charge. We rarely drive more than 50 miles in a day, so overnight charging works fine for us. You did not say where you live, but time of use billing can save a lot of money for some people. By charging off peak, which usually gives me a full charge, I pay about half of the non time of use rate. But you really need to look at your life style to determine if time of use will help on your bill.

Car Seats - I use a car seat with my 2 year old grand daughter. Fits okay, but she kicks the seat in front of her if its not pulled a bit forward. With a rear facing seat I suggest taking your car seat to the dealer and seing how it fits.

Stroller - Umbrella stroller fits fine. Again, take your stroller to the dealer and see if it fits.

Regarding quality of the Volt as another posted negatively ... My Volt is just over 1 year old, has zero defects and has not had a single issue. I believe there are many Volt owners with a similar experience.

 

I can only comment on #1 --

The Volt is designed with the 110V use case in mind. Yes, you can have a higher percentage on grid power if you have a faster charger, but I recommend not obsessing about that. Plug it in and let it slow-charge overnight, and let it slow-charge at work if you have access to a plug. Don't worry that the engine comes on sometimes. With that attitude, our Volt -- which is our only long-distance car, given that our other car is a pure EV -- has done 27K/31K miles on grid power. *And it's a perfectly lovely little car once the engine spins up.* Put it in sport mode, enjoy the silence and the zip, and love the money that you save on gas and on not having to splurge for an expensive charger. When the ICE kicks in, just tell yourself: "I'm now getting the same MPG as a Civic, and I can drive across the country if I want to."

 

With this reasoning, might as well get a Civic since it's cheaper, right? ;D

tell yourself: "I'm now getting the same MPG as a Civic, and I can drive across the country if I want to."

 

It will depend greatly on your personal usage patterns if a L2 charger is a good thing or not. I thought L1 would be fine until I actually tried living with it. I found that my usage patterns required a little bit of gas usage just about every day. I had plenty of time between trips to top off the battery at L2, but it wouldn't quite make it at L1. I typically drive somewhere between 40 and 70 miles per day and 100 miles isn't uncommon. With L2 charging, I can do all of those miles on electricity. The hard numbers ended up being far more economical to buy a L2 EVSE. (Actually, I built my own using the OpenEVSE kit, but that's not something I recommend unless you have at least a basic understanding of how to do electronics technician work).

Prior to L2 charging, I was running about 65% electric. After L2, I got up to 92%. Right now with the extended cold weather, I'm still holding 88%. Since I drive about 20,000 miles per year with my Volt, the difference adds up to well over $500 worth of fuel that I didn't have to buy thanks to the faster charging of L2. I'm not a math genius, but I can figure out that my $300 L2 EVSE was a great investment. Even a $700 L2 EVSE would be a bargain after 3 years of use. Another angle to consider too: If it didn't save me a nickel, I'd still think it was a great investment purely for the fact that I don't have to remember to change the charging setting every stupid time I drive the car. My frustration with that stupid "feature" was worth every penny.

 

An L2 charger charges at about 10 miles per hour. A lot of times I get home from work with 1-2 miles left on the battery, in an hour or two I can take the family out to dinner on that L2 fast charge. Less ICE miles = less oil changes. I have near 90% electric thanks to L2

I've also driven 80+ miles all electric in one day! something you can't do with L1

 

I have two reasons to get the L2 charger:

1. The L2 charger allows you to pre-condition your car - heat or AC depending on the season. This adds comfort and can save range by not working the system as hard after you depart

2. I keep my L1 charger in he trunk for travel and have the convenience of not having to yank it out each night and wind it up each day. this saves time and gets me an extra charge on those occasional long drives.

So it's all comfort and convenience.

 

Curious what kit you built. I am assuming probably this one -

http://openevse-store.myshopify.com...hopify.com/collections/full-kits/products/diy-openevse-30a-charge-station-combo

What enclosure? I think you said your total cost was $300?

 

Thank you everyone for your information on the three topics!!

I really want to get the L2 charger but getting the wife on board for this since I'm going to be leasing will be hard. Is there any location I can buy a used one? I can afford a $500 charger with no problem but if I can get one for $250/300 used I much rather do that then in the future invest on a new one.

Here is my quote I'm going to hope to get in the next few days I will be putting $3000 down PLUS I just grabed the $1000 private offer this morning so I will have to get a new quote with the added $1000

Option 2: 2014 Chevy Volt (Black), with Safety Pkg 1 and Heated Seats, with MSRP of $35,830 = $205/mo

 

Just got the new quote with the $1000 private offer 176 a month 15,000 miles a year and all the options in the above quote

 

An Open EVSE might be your solution for an L2 charger. Once you have the Volt you probably won't ever go back to an ICE.
http://code.google.com/p/open-evse/
http://openevse-store.myshopify.com/

We have a pair of L2, In fact I don't ever think the L1 have been out of the trunk. It is so nice to grab a charge and go again. The wife has a 78.9 mile day and my 2012 has a 99.75 mile day, really almost impossible with an L1 charger.

$176 is a screaming deal for a Volt lease. You will probably save that much in gas, I know my 18K miles Volt has only used 50.1 gallons in 26 months and that is with a few trips. Most trips are limited to a few hundred miles, if we go further than that we fly usually.

 

I second the Clipper Creek buy in. I installed a CC HCDS-40 bought direct from Clipper Creek.

Firehawk is correct, I didn't buy the L2 EVSE to save money, it was to speed my charge times. Running a 14 y/o around town will use 25-35 miles then you can go back home and recharge and be ready for the rest of the day running only EV miles.

I used my Volt supplied 110 volt charger ( I know, it's not a charger...) just a week before I upgraded. Charging was too slow!

You'll really enjoy the Volt. It has instant torque (say speed!) is comfortable even for this 6'3" guy and the stares you'll get are priceless.

 

Glad to see another tall person that can be fit comfortable in the car I'm 6'2" I felt very comfy when I took a test drive so I should have no problems driving everyday.

I will def have to work on the wife getting a L2 while I have a lease I totally understand where she is coming from on the price of about $500 for a L2 and I only have a lease... Like I said is there any sites that sell used? I'm not looking to build a charger even though I build computers for a living I think I may be barking up the wrong tree... So maybe when I hit my 1 year anniversary I'll look back see the savings I have gotten and try it again with the wife or if I can find a used one she might go for it more.

Thanks!!

 

Hi Mike,
Just to add/reinforce what a number of others have already said:

Re: TOU electric rates. I had the Volt for a few months before switching to a TOU meter. We made some lifestyle adjustments (wait until 7PM to run the dishwasher, put the basement dehumidifier on a timer, etc) run the A/C colder/harder during off-peak and on low during peak, etc. Now we use over 90% of our household electricity off-peak. It helps that where we are the off-peak is a generous 7PM-12PM, but basically changing to TOU billing compensated financially for charging the Volt every night. Our electric bills went up when I first got the Volt, then after we switched to TOU our bills went back to what they were before I started charging the Volt every night. The electric company did not charge us anything to swap meters, so it's worth looking into TOU metering even if you don't have an EV!!!

Re: 110v s 220v - I had my Volt for about 9 months before installing a 220V charger. You can get along just fine without one. For my daily commute charging overnight was just fine. But I found that on the weekends I would drain the battery on a saturday morning and want another full charge by afternoon. How much do I save by doing this? Maybe $2 each time. So it will take a long time to add up the savings versus the cost of the 220V charger. My charger is a Clipper Creek, which goes for about $500 plus installation. My installation was about $100 because I did it myself, cost of installation may vary greatly depending on your electrician. I've heard from $250 to $1000 depending how far they need to run wires, whether main panels needed to be upgraded, etc. But the Volt only draws 16A on 220v, so it really only needs an additional two 20A breakers. I was fortunate to already have that in my garage from an old air compressor that was no longer in use, so it was a shoe-in install for me.

I figure I "save" about $5 per week in not-gas use by being able to charge quickly, plus I cut down on cold starts for the engine. I'm not shy about exceeding my EV range and burning gas. I manage about 70% electric driving. I've got a busy life and tight schedule that keeps us moving all the time. So it should only take me 2-3 years to 'pay for' my installation. I also feel better about using more electric and less gas. That's a feeling that may set upon you as you use your Volt more and more.

edit - I'm 6'4" and don't keep the seat all the way back. I do have to duck my head when I get in and out. When my daughter sits behind me I slide the seat up another two notches, I'm not uncomfortable but I do know it's a small car.

 

Hi Mike,
Just to add/reinforce what a number of others have already said:

Re: TOU electric rates. I had the Volt for a few months before switching to a TOU meter. We made some lifestyle adjustments (wait until 7PM to run the dishwasher, put the basement dehumidifier on a timer, etc) run the A/C colder/harder during off-peak and on low during peak, etc. Now we use over 90% of our household electricity off-peak. It helps that where we are the off-peak is a generous 7PM-12PM, but basically changing to TOU billing compensated financially for charging the Volt every night. Our electric bills went up when I first got the Volt, then after we switched to TOU our bills went back to what they were before I started charging the Volt every night. The electric company did not charge us anything to swap meters, so it's worth looking into TOU metering even if you don't have

I actually am planning on moving over to the TOU plan on calling them this week to get it installed. I take delivery on my new Volt Feb 28th!!! Just put my down payment on it today so I'm all in

Our off peak hours go from 7pm-11am so plenty of time to charge on a 110v I leave for work at 4:30am