[wssix99]

Toyota has unveiled the Chevy Volt III, the fifth-generation Prius in Europe, which comes exclusively as a plug-in hybrid, and it has a driver instrument cluster!

This is not comparable to the Volt. It's just another hybrid. (They have put better lipstick on the pig with a plug-in charging system and bigger battery.)

The engine is still connected to the wheels, the engine will run at highway speeds, and this car won't be able to match the Volt's efficiency. (For an extended range electric car.)

 

[obermd]

This is not comparable to the Volt. It's just another hybrid. (They have put better lipstick on the pig with a plug-in charging system and bigger battery.)

The engine is still connected to the wheels, the engine will run at highway speeds, and this car won't be able to match the Volt's efficiency. (For an extended range electric car.)

While I suspect you're correct, do you have a source for this other than a strong suspicion that Toyota will be using their Hybrid Synergy drive in this?

 

[wssix99]

I'm assuming that Toyota is brining back one of the legs of the previous three-prong Prius offering they had previously: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Prius_Plug-in_Hybrid

Toyota is also promoting the horsepower of the car and adding the power of the electric motor and the ICE, so I deduce that this means they must be mechanically joined. Hybrid Reborn: 2023 Toyota Prius Revealed - Toyota USA Newsroom

After reading this, I went back to the details of the Buick Velite (China's Volt) and was disappointed to see that GM switched paths. It looks like they took the Volt battery, made it smaller and then grafted it to a traditional hybrid powertrain:

 

[SkipperHugh]

Toyota has unveiled the Chevy Volt III, the fifth-generation Prius in Europe, which comes exclusively as a plug-in hybrid, and it has a driver instrument cluster!

2023 Toyota Prius Unveiled In Europe As Plug-In Hybrid Only Model

The Prius Plug-in Hybrid is powered by a 2.0-liter gasoline engine and an electric motor that deliver more power—220 horsepower—and greater efficiency.

insideevs.com

I would be tempted....except while they increased the BatteryOnly range from 25-35 miles my Gen1 Volt still goes 42 miles on the battery (in ideal conditions=no rain and 50F+). I will say that the new Prius is very good looking.

 

[oldmalegeek]

From the article referenced in the first post:

Note that says based on a UK range of 39 miles for the current Prius. according to the Toyota website the 2022 Prius Prime has a range of 25 miles, so that would mean a range of about 38 miles for the 2023 (25*1.5=37.5). Still I like it and may consider buying in 2024.

 

[carroll.vance]

I would guess 10 kWh usable battery power out of the 13.6 KWh battery pack. At 4 miles per kWh, that is an expected range of 40 miles, significantly less that 58 mile range mentioned in the article. Did the efficiency go way up, to 6 miles per kWh? Hard to see how Toyota could do that without carbon fiber everywhere and super low coefficient of drag.

"The motor is powered by a new 13.6 kWh lithium-ion battery that offers a 50 percent longer all-electric driving range than the current generation. This would suggest an EV range of around 58 miles (95 kilometers) judging by the current 39-mile (63-km) figure in the UK."

 

[scottf200]

Toyota unveils new Prius hybrids amid skepticism of its EV strategy

Moving forward with the Prius as other automakers vow to go all-electric in the years ahead is part of Toyota CEO Akio Toyoda's electrification strategy.

www.cnbc.com

It will be curious what the starting price of the 2023 is with the larger battery and electric motor.

Via article above: "The 2022 Prius Prime plug-in hybrid starts at about $29,000 and has a 133 MPGe, which takes into account the 25-mile all-electric range of the vehicle as well as the fuel economy of its gas-powered engine."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Prius#Fifth_generation_(XW60;_2022)

"The fifth-generation Prius was unveiled on 16 November 2022,[12] with two powertrain options announced for the Japanese market. The first uses Toyota's Series Parallel Hybrid System, available in 1.8-litre (2ZR-FXE) and 2.0-litre (M20A-FXS) variants and producing up to 103 kW (138 hp; 140 PS) and 144 or 146 kW (193 or 196 hp; 196 or 199 PS) respectively. This model is also available with E-Four all-wheel drive system. The second, a plug-in hybrid, combines a 2.0-litre M20A-FXS engine, an electric motor and lithium-ion batteries to produce a combined output of 164 kW (220 hp; 223 PS).[75]"

 

[bobroth4433]

Something does not compute. All EV range of 58 miles on a 13KWH battery? I think that was a mis-print. I believe the comparison should have been between the current Prius Prime with 25 mile range. That would give the new model about 38 miles of range. Similar to Gen 1 Volt. I wonder if it uses premium gas? (lol)

 

[hellsop]

My Volt has a 16.0 kWh battery. I get to use just under 10 of that. Why do think it's a misprint, and in which direction? Do you think they stated physical capacity or usable?

 

[Steverino]

Something does not compute. All EV range of 58 miles on a 13KWH battery?

European test method?

 

[sbachman7117]

Gen 1 Volt, but built today. Anyone wondering what parts of the battery can be replaced after warranty? Cell? Module? Section? Or does the whole thing need to be replaced?

Yes, I am wondering those things!

 

[hellsop]

European test method?

That's less than 4.5 miles per kwh, if the "13" is usable. That's optimistic but hardly impossible.

 

[arbus]

From Consumer Reports:
"By Toyota’s estimates, the Prius should be EPA-rated at 57 mpg combined. The new Prius Prime should get at least a 50 percent longer all-electric range. The EPA estimates that the current Prius gets 22 miles per charge before it transitions to regular hybrid operation." (emphasis mine)

I take that to mean 22 * 50% + 22 = 11 + 22 = 33 miles.

That's a might disappointing. But it is what it is.

No mention of passive v. active management of battery temperature.

The article is here:
2023 Toyota Prius and Prius Prime Preview - Consumer Reports

 

[Christian777]

Surely they've learned by now You need active thermal battery management to get any longevity.

 

[arbus]

Surely they've learned by now You need active thermal battery management to get any longevity.

I do believe that in the 2022 version of the Prime its smaller battery is fan-cooled with cabin air and heated electrically.

The how and why and when of 2023, I don't find.

 

[Fred_B]

I read somewhere (but don't remember where) that the 2023 Prius battery is liquid cooled.

 

[Whatstreet]

I bet the battery thermal management will be the same as the Rav4 Prime.

Details on the RAV4 Prime battery pack construction and temperature control | GM Volt Forum (gm-volt.com)

Unfortunately, the Rav4 Prime is difficult to obtain and I think it is likely that this version of the Prius won't be any more available.

 

[Voltmobile]

I bet it’ll be popular cause it looks 10x better than the previous versions which was just plain ugly. Also the EV of 58 miles is quite good.

 

[DeanRHolden]

I like the looks, but am disappointed by the range. It's no Volt replacement. I'm still hoping for more PHEVs with 50+ range.

 

[dvb]

There won't be any, I think. As it was said, an average user needs 50 km per day. So, why making a larger battery? It's heavier and more expensive.

Even if a new chemistry doubles the output, they will just cut the pack by 2.