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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I leased my 2013 Volt and in a few months the lease will be up. The residual value built into the agreement is in the $26K range. Out of curiosity I went on KBB to see if maybe it was worth more than that on the private-sell market (greedy me thinking I'd sell it, then give GM their resid value and pocket the difference). Lo and behold, the "private sale" price on KBB was $17.1K -- and trade-in value a mere $15.5K. That is one heck of a lot of value lost for a car in truly perfect condition with only 17,000 miles on it. Has GM hosed themselves by calculating my lease on the basis of a $26K residual value, or is KBB full of horsefeathers...or is there something I fail to understand that is going on here?
 

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Is the bank you leased from either U.S. Bank or Ally Bank? If so, then GM wasn't involved, afaik.

I spoke to my trusty salesman a while ago about the loss that Ally Bank was going to suffer by not negotiating with me to buy the car at less than the stated residual. He came back with "Oh, they have insurance to cover the loss when the car is auctioned at a lower price." I don't know how true that is, but it does seem to answer why the banks stone wall a negotiated buy-out. I figured that I would agree to buy my leased Volt for $10,000 less than the stated residual, but, in the end, I decided that I would buy the 2016 instead. The 2012 was/is some nice car, though!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I'm concerned that the 2016 will be less of a car in some respect. I read about GM trying to lower the price, which can only mean one thing. You're right, the 2013 is a superb vehicle and I had fantasized a negotiated buyout based on real prices rather than their fantasy "residual value," and yes it's US Bank. Thanks for disabusing me of that idea, I won't waste time trying. Now holding my breath that the 2nd-Gen is as good a car because keeping this one (at 10K above market) isn't an option. (If only there were some way to follow it to auction and buy it back there..!)
 

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The leasing company (owner) is eligible for the $7500 tax credit. They therefore pad the residual by that amount so that the consumer's payments are lower. This means that there is no way the consumer can buy the car at the end because it is under water by $7500 or more.

And you're not doing a private sale or buying for trade-in value, you're buying at the dealer's lot price which is whatever they paid at auction plus their profit plus whatever other F&I product they can add to the deal you sign.
 

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The leasing company (owner) is eligible for the $7500 tax credit. They therefore pad the residual by that amount so that the consumer's payments are lower. This means that there is no way the consumer can buy the car at the end because it is under water by $7500 or more.

And you're not doing a private sale or buying for trade-in value, you're buying at the dealer's lot price which is whatever they paid at auction plus their profit plus whatever other F&I product they can add to the deal you sign.
This is only true for US Bank- Ally gives you the rebate (or portion of it) as a cap cost reduction.

Regardless, yes, the resale on Volts, even factoring in $7500 off, has proven very disappointing.
 

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I'm concerned that the 2016 will be less of a car in some respect. I read about GM trying to lower the price, which can only mean one thing. You're right, the 2013 is a superb vehicle and I had fantasized a negotiated buyout based on real prices rather than their fantasy "residual value," and yes it's US Bank. Thanks for disabusing me of that idea, I won't waste time trying. Now holding my breath that the 2nd-Gen is as good a car because keeping this one (at 10K above market) isn't an option. (If only there were some way to follow it to auction and buy it back there..!)
From what I have heard, only licensed (what kind, IDK) individuals may participate in these car auctions... yeah, I thought of that, too.

Yes, I'm on pins and needles wanting to see how much value has been designed out of the 2016 in order to reduce the price. Can I naively think that all the value of the Gen 1 will be there? LOL One thing, though, the seats better be as comfortable as the 2012s were, or I am going to be one pissed new owner!
 

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If you think used GEN1 VOlt resale prices are low, wait until the gen 2 comes out, it will be even lower.
I honestly think the gen2 VOlt WILL NOT be any less of a car.
I believe it will be the opposite - a BETTER car. They had 4 years to learn and build this gen2 car based on customer feedback - like us here on this forum.
I am looking forward seeing it later this year.
Hoping it will have HD FM capable radio.
 

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If you think used GEN1 VOlt resale prices are low, wait until the gen 2 comes out, it will be even lower.
I honestly think the gen2 VOlt WILL NOT be any less of a car.
I believe it will be the opposite - a BETTER car. They had 4 years to learn and build this gen2 car based on customer feedback - like us here on this forum.
I am looking forward seeing it later this year.
Hoping it will have HD FM capable radio.
An HD radio certainly would be nice to listen to in the super quiet of the Gen 2. I hope that one is offered.

As to your other sentiments, yes, GM did have enough time to fully engineer Gen 2 and incorporate many of the suggestions made in this forum. One of the BIG suggestions was to reduce the price. And that's my concern. Will there be cheaper materials, simpler designs of items to allow less cost and faster assembly, resulting in a flimsier car? Someone posted a reduction in the price of the seat assembly - by half, IIRC. Does the reduced price reflect cheaper materials, simpler construction, faster assembly, resulting in a less supportive and less comfortable seat? Inquiring minds want to know...8^/
 

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I believe that GM can, on balance, benefit from the current Gen 1 low used value. All these cars, many near-new, are now selling to lucky buyers for half of the new price they couldn't afford before. More great, reliable cars out there being talked up, seen, added to the total. All good. And we who hate to give up our marvelous cars will have to settle for a gen 2 or buy on that used market.
Prius was slow to start then took off. I think the same will happen when that elusive critical mass (of Volts on the road) is reached in coming years. Anecdote: a pre-'13 Volt has showed up in a driveway in a Newport Beach, CA neighborhood where I regularly bicycle. This is Tesla Country and NB residents would sooner eat dirt that be seen driving a Chevy (Tahoes excepted) I am hopeful.
 

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There are infinite number of ways to cut cost. I think you hit on a few with materials simpler design and quicker/easier assembly, but there is also some facts that they have share. Leveraging parts seems like every part except the exterior is used on Malibu, CT6, Spark you would be suprised how much volume (Economy of scale) truly pulls cost out. the voltec system is in the Malibu and CT6 batteries are in all and interior is in Malibu. They have also mentioned the significant reduction of rare earth metals and all the weight it lost that material costs money. O and battery costs who knows what the cost actually is but its less then 4 years ago, I have read the cost has been dropping about 8% per year that would bring today's batteries cost 71.6% of 4 years ago. . Yes I'm sure they're was cheaper materials used in certain areas. Warrenty costs also will decrease if they go to 5yr/60,000mi instead of 5yr/100,000mi. Of course this is all speculation and educated guesses but i think they can achieve their cost cutting of 10k off the original 40k price but they want margins so $32k should make everyone happy congrats to GM if they can do better.
 

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There are infinite number of ways to cut cost. I think you hit on a few with materials simpler design and quicker/easier assembly, but there is also some facts that they have share. Leveraging parts seems like every part except the exterior is used on Malibu, CT6, Spark you would be suprised how much volume (Economy of scale) truly pulls cost out. the voltec system is in the Malibu and CT6 batteries are in all and interior is in Malibu. They have also mentioned the significant reduction of rare earth metals and all the weight it lost that material costs money. O and battery costs who knows what the cost actually is but its less then 4 years ago, I have read the cost has been dropping about 8% per year that would bring today's batteries cost 71.6% of 4 years ago. . Yes I'm sure they're was cheaper materials used in certain areas. Warrenty costs also will decrease if they go to 5yr/60,000mi instead of 5yr/100,000mi. Of course this is all speculation and educated guesses but i think they can achieve their cost cutting of 10k off the original 40k price but they want margins so $32k should make everyone happy congrats to GM if they can do better.
Yes, there is all that, too. And I am counting on those things coming into play in the creation of the Gen 2. I'm just sayin' I'm a bit leery.

Not that any of that will stop me from buying the Gen 2 and taking a road trip to Muscatine to visit the grave sites of my relatives reposing in Greenwood Cemetery and to Iowa City for the same at Oakland Cemetery and Memorial Gardens Cemetery on Old Route US 6. I have many fond boyhood memories of visiting relatives at 210 West 8th Street in Muscatine and living with my grandparents at 311 E Davenport Street in Iowa City. I enjoy visiting Iowa and reminiscing.
 

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assumed lease residuals were set artificially high to keep payments down. I paid $27K net for my 2013, so after 2 years of use, is $10K depreciation really that much? There are plenty of clean used volts out there, or if you really want to buy your own car back, you could hire a 2nd tier used car dealer to go to the auction and buy it for you. good luck.
 

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mark ruess said they could reduce the cost of the volt by $10,000 simply by using a purpose built approach. This implied that decontenting/cheaper materials were not necessary to achieve a reduction of up to $10,000.
 

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The artificially high resale was the reason I didn't want to lease. It actually hurts in two ways. One is that, as you've found out, you really don't want to buy the car even if you do want to buy the car. The other is that you end up paying interest on a phantom $22,500.00.

Some people, however, have been able to negotiate a lower buyout from the lessor. Some haven't. If you haven't given that a try it's likely worth the effort of a phone call or two.
 

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Looking at this from the other side, with pre-owned prices so low I hope folks start snapping them up. What a great deal for someone. Pre-owned Volt's could be the best new source of advertising and office water cooler chatter, and thus increasing positive views of the Gen II Volt.

My 2012 Volt that I traded in last July finally sold to a local lady who is in love with it.
 

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I recently bought out my 2012 Volt from US Bank. The local dealer had an exact match for my car, and I almost bought that, but they wouldn't come down below $18k.
I ended up paying $17.5k for mine.
 

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I don't understand how leasing protects someone from depreciation. For example, the best lease payment we could find on our 2014, 17 months ago was $360.00/ month (not including taxes, and $0.00 down). We decided to buy and paid $26,500 net after tax credits, financed at 0% for four years. If the car is now worth $22,000.00, that is $4500.00 depreciation in 17 months, or $265.00/ month. In our case, leasing would have been more expensive, especially as the depreciation curve flattens out over time.

The Volt is caught up in the current trend away from economy cars to bigger vehicles due to normalized fuel prices. If gas goes back up, then Volt resale value will pick up as well. In the meantime, the Volt is an outstanding value.

And, I think if Gen 2 is popular and sells well, then the Gen 1 cars will benefit and resale values will stabilize.
 

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Leasing benefits usually the bank. You pay for THEIR depreciation and GM gets a car sale. AT the end, you have paid 13,000 dollars and have nothing. They have the fed tax credit and the car and the depreciation paid for. $39000 -13000-7500 = 19,500 left and since the bank is a business, they write off the depreciation and loss when they cant sell it for the residual. They arent dummies.
 
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