GM Volt Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
405 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I'm wondering if some sort of RFID could be built into the EVSE cord such that if it is stolen, it could be found (such as by OnStar) and retrieved.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
20,231 Posts
Google RFID range like I did.


Ultra High Frequency (UHF) Passive RFID Tags - minimum read distance of over 1 meter or 3 feet. Gen2 tags can have a read range of up to 12 meters or 37 feet, however new generation of IC's plus antenna designs are now pushing this distance to over 15 meters (162 feet)! Ignoring the cost, I think you could see if your neighbor (or car) next door (within 3, 37 or 162 feet) was using your EVSE. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,766 Posts
I just received a Tile electronic locator tag as a gift. Tile Premium (at an additional monthly cost of $2.99/mo) includes an ability to use Tile Smart Alerts. Smart Alerts will alert on your phone via the Tile App if you leave your house without the Tile tracked item (briefcase, house keys etc.) If you attached a Tile device to your EVSE and the EVSE walks away you would receive an alert on your phone. Of course every time you leave home without your EVSE you would also receive an alert on your phone. Still, Tile might be something to look into to address EVSE security.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,440 Posts
I think GM's approach to the stolen cord problem was the cord theft alarm. Nissan has a mechanism that traps the charge cord plug in the car's charge port. You can also use various methods to lock your cord yourself. I guess once it is gone, it is gone. There is no lojack feature yet used by any of the brands.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
405 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I think GM's approach to the stolen cord problem was the cord theft alarm. Nissan has a mechanism that traps the charge cord plug in the car's charge port. You can also use various methods to lock your cord yourself. I guess once it is gone, it is gone. There is no lojack feature yet used by any of the brands.
As far as I know, you're right that there is not yet any Lojack type of feature on EVSE offered by any of the brands. I think the reason I put this point in the suggestion area is simply to suggest that a Lojack type of feature be offered on EVSE, if it can be done cost-effectively.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,440 Posts
I think with the Tesla super charging system, information is passed through the charge cord to the charge station from the car, such as the VIN, and that is networked back to some Tesla server. It would probably be possible for a system like that to pick up an ID number from an EVSE as well, and network it (probably through the car's network connection). I could see that possibly being used to locate or lock out a stolen EVSE.

However, within the current J1772 standard, there is probably no provision for any information like that to pass between car/EVSE. And changing these standards is a big deal (not within GM's control). There is also no obvious way to network it except through OnStar, which would only work on certain vehicles. So you would need a separate communication channel, like a dedicated cellular device within the EVSE. Maintaining cellular accounts for each EVSE would require a recurring monthly expense, so that is probably not realistic because few owners would be willing to pay for it.

I think the bottom line is that if something can be replaced for a few hundred dollars, then it is not worth an expensive, high-tech security system.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,590 Posts
the Tile device also can use a croud/cloud based system where other Tile app users smartphone will find your TILE if they pass by and send a message to your phone. There are other like devices that do the same.

I have one on my cat - most times the music the tile plays when tracking is triggered will get him to come home.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
20,231 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,440 Posts
the Tile device also can use a crowd/cloud based system where other Tile app users smartphone will find your TILE if they pass by and send a message to your phone. There are other like devices that do the same.
The crowd feature is interesting in theory, but it does require another Tile user to pass close by the lost tile. If someone is using the EVSE at their home, that will likely never happen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
405 Posts
Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
This part of the forum is (going by the name) for suggestions to GM. So, it's interesting to see the workaround ideas, and they do help in some cases with personal practices, or in refining the suggestion, but they are not as to-the-point here as they would be for direct driver questions which are asked in other areas. If anything, the existence of driver workarounds may signal that a suggestion to an automaker is warranted.

There's too much I don't know about whether an "RFID" idea, or other similar solution, would work well and be cost-effective. I did at one time get Lojack for my laptop, though I think it may have been the case that this was predicated on it being turned on and connected in some way, in order to locate it? I don't know. I was always disappointed in some of the testimonials I read about that product, since they did not seem to indicate a quick recovery time.

For EVSE, when I had a Leaf, I remember seeing an estimate of about $1k for the EVSE, but I don't know what the replacement cost or manufacturing cost is on the Volt. Indeed, I suppose if it's only a few hundred dollars, then this would reduce (but not eliminate) the incentive to eliminate theft and loss. If somehow a solution were to be engineered into the OEM or third party EVSE that involved plugging in and communicating an id and perhaps a location (or an associated vehicle) then this would work for a percentage of cases, but not others where they might avoid (for whatever reason) plugging it in for some time, or ever (such as if it is lost).

As to wireless communication and location, sure, there are various technical question marks including how far the signal travels, though I think the mention of the Tile seems really helpful to get an idea of some pros/cons.

Overall, I'm not sure that this is a good suggestion to the manufacturer that I've made (probably not very cost effective), but it does seem (to me) worth mulling over the ins and outs, given the concern over theft or loss that comes up time and again in some scenarios. At first glance, and not having tried it yet, I do like the workaround ideas of stringing through my wheel and pad-locking, or keeping some of it in the car (does this require a window to be slightly open? This has me wondering if if portable EVSE is really needed at all. Perhaps a way would be to hard-wire in effect an extension cord into the car, separate from the J1772 plug. Or perhaps create a durable purpose-built unobtrusive spot somewhere on the outside where the EVSE could be locked into place.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,440 Posts
Another possibility is to follow the iPhone model. Make the device useless for anyone other than the owner. That takes away the incentive to steal it-- assuming the thief knows. Also assuming they want it to use rather than for parts or the copper salvage value.

This could be done by having the owner encode his VIN or VINs into the EVSE. It would only work with those cars. This would still require passing data between the car and EVSE, which may conflict with the J1772 standard, but it eliminates all the networking/locating aspect and simplifies the problem. Maybe a future revision to J1772 could accommodate passing that kind of data.

To make it more user friendly, the EVSE could automatically encode the first car that it is plugged into, so no programming required for a simple use case.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
514 Posts
Anything that adds to the cost of manufacturing an EVSE would make them even more likely to get stolen - Conversely, when they get cheap enough, their resale value would be so low, few would risk stealing one just to get $50 if they could find a buyer

I remember when we ought our first iMiEV in early 2012, an L1 12 amp EVSE was about $350 from Home Depot - Now you can buy 16 amp L2's made in China for less than half of that. One day, they'll be under $100. Just the parts to build my own Open EVSE cost me significantly more than that!

Don
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,766 Posts
Anything that adds to the cost of manufacturing an EVSE would make them even more likely to get stolen - Conversely, when they get cheap enough, their resale value would be so low, few would risk stealing one just to get $50 if they could find a buyer

I remember when we ought our first iMiEV in early 2012, an L1 12 amp EVSE was about $350 from Home Depot - Now you can buy 16 amp L2's made in China for less than half of that. One day, they'll be under $100. Just the parts to build my own Open EVSE cost me significantly more than that!

Don
A portable EVSE that is not secured will always be an easy target for theft, if only for the copper wiring.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,440 Posts
A portable EVSE that is not secured will always be an easy target for theft, if only for the copper wiring.
If someone just wants the copper from the cable, and they are prepared with a cutter, then there is practically no way to secure against that anyway, except for building a fence around the whole car. Padlocking the cable, locking the plug to the car, stringing it out of the trunk, or having a tracker in the box won't help. We can only hope that want the EVSE intact.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
20,231 Posts
If someone just wants the copper from the cable, and they are prepared with a cutter, then there is practically no way to secure against that anyway, except for building a fence around the whole car. Padlocking the cable, locking the plug to the car, stringing it out of the trunk, or having a tracker in the box won't help. We can only hope that want the EVSE intact.
Very little copper wiring. That cord is not very long. I have more copper in my 50' outdoor extension cord. How many extension cords are stolen for the copper? I suspect not many. Copper pipes is were the money is.
 

·
Senior Member
Joined
·
1,027 Posts
Very little copper wiring. That cord is not very long. I have more copper in my 50' outdoor extension cord. How many extension cords are stolen for the copper? I suspect not many. Copper pipes is were the money is.
I've seen people burn whole buildings down and hack up tens of thousands of $$ of equipment and risk their lives for $30 of scrap value, or perceived scrap value.

People here have started cutting down light poles and raiding substations. They do not care.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
514 Posts
Very little copper wiring. That cord is not very long. I have more copper in my 50' outdoor extension cord. How many extension cords are stolen for the copper? I suspect not many. Copper pipes is were the money is.
Agreed - I doubt there's much more than a dollar's worth of scrap value copper in a portable EVSE

Don
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
20,231 Posts
I've seen people burn whole buildings down and hack up tens of thousands of $$ of equipment and risk their lives for $30 of scrap value, or perceived scrap value.

People here have started cutting down light poles and raiding substations. They do not care.
Sure, but there is more scrap $ in one of your aluminum wheels. All that's needed a a lug wrench and a few bricks.

And compared to that, your catalytic converter is a veritable gold mine. A cordless saw and a few minutes is all it takes.

The value in an EVSE is not in scrap, it's in it being an EVSE on ebay.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,766 Posts
Sure, but there is more scrap $ in one of your aluminum wheels. All that's needed a a lug wrench and a few bricks.

And compared to that, your catalytic converter is a veritable gold mine. A cordless saw and a few minutes is all it takes.

The value in an EVSE is not in scrap, it's in it being an EVSE on ebay.
Tweakers don't surf! (the web)
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top