GM Volt Forum banner

1 - 20 of 70 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
135 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Saw this today at reddit:

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/help-a-pillar-defect-found.88657/

https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/63wn7j/tesla_delivers_brand_new_s90d_with_cracked_apillar/



While I appreciate what Tesla is doing for the EV market, this kind stuff worries me.

I assume traditional automakers such as GM with 100+ years of car making experience will not have something like this happening? For people in the know, how do automakers detect these kind of defects during manufacturing that Tesla is obviously missing?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,289 Posts
Gotta cram in those last minute sales for the quarter! Quality takes a back seat to quantity in March, June, Sep, and December for Tesla.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,230 Posts
My take here is, how did this get past the delivery check and why didn't the customer notice then when they took delivery. Its really large and in an obvious spot. A great reminder, you go over EVERY inch of what you are buying before you sign
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
19,982 Posts
You can see why Musk feels Tesla can skip that old-fashioned beta-testing that GM and others do. No time for that, lol. On the other hand, Tesla buyers do not seem bothered by defects the way they would be if the car came from GM.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,431 Posts
The final quality control check after the assembly is what makes many other vehicle manufacturers famous. It is a required feedback for the manufacturing and assembly processes. GM does it for every model, and the control checks may takes days or even weeks, which is the first delay for shipment after the vehicle leaves the assembly area. We can probably guess that the first 2017 Chevy Bolt EVs were assembled in October and November, and the quality checks caused the dealer deliveries to occur in December.

But this event is disturbing for the Tesla Motors quality issues, especially for the buyer after putting down over $100,000 for a car unseen before paying. If I were one of TM managers, I would return the car to assembly, have the part replaced, and bill the replacement to the employee responsible for this bad event, or to the supplier if that was the origin.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
135 Posts
Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
A great reminder, you go over EVERY inch of what you are buying before you sign
Easier said than done. :) Despite my careful inspection, and trying multiple cars, my 2013 Volt had a minor defect that I only discovered afterwards. On the rear, for some reason, the right side sits slightly higher than the left side (1/8" of an inch). The car has performed flawlessly so far, but I did kick myself for not discovering this during the inspection! So can't catch them all I suppose. ;)

After discovering this, I checked my 1999 Maxima and 2011 Murano. Both are perfectly level.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
19,982 Posts
Easier said than done. :) Despite my careful inspection, and trying multiple cars, my 2013 Volt had a minor defect that I only discovered afterwards. On the rear, for some reason, the right side sits slightly higher than the left side (1/8" of an inch). The car has performed flawlessly all these years, but I did kick myself for not discovering this during the inspection.
It sounds silly, but I recommend using a white glove and slide your fingers over every square inch before taking delivery. It's the same reason CSI detectives are shown using a small flashlight to go over a crime scene, it helps you focus on the details and not be overwhelmed by all the visual input. It's MUCH easier to get a defect fixed when you find it at time of delivery than if you come back in a day or week. Avoid the dispute and hassle, bring a white glove. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,405 Posts
It sounds silly, but I recommend using a white glove and slide your fingers over every square inch before taking delivery. It's the same reason CSI detectives are shown using a small flashlight to go over a crime scene, it helps you focus on the details and not be overwhelmed by all the visual input. It's MUCH easier to get a defect fixed when you find it at time of delivery than if you come back in a day or week. Avoid the dispute and hassle, bring a white glove. :)
For that damage in the first post, a white glove and flashlight is overkill.

I'd use a white cane and seeing-eye dog.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
19,982 Posts
For that damage in the first post, a white glove and flashlight is overkill.

I'd use a white cane and seeing-eye dog.
hahaha, good point! Obviously this example is an egregious case. A small dent, paint defect, missing trim, interior stain, poor fit, etc. can be easily overlooked by an excited owner taking possession of their new car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
135 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
It sounds silly, but I recommend using a white glove and slide your fingers over every square inch before taking delivery.
I am curious to know if I can request to inspect the underside of the car when buying. ;) On my next new car purchase I am going to do that and see what they say. ;) Do you think they'll laugh at my face, say something along the line of its not safe for you to be in the shop area where they jack up cars? Or they'll agree and just jackup the car in their lift and say, see, everything's fine!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
188 Posts
Tesla is in over their heads. They are ramping up for the Model 3 when they can't even make the Model S, after 5 years, or the Model X. The guy that sold me my Volt had bought a Model X that he was only able to put 400 miles on in 3 months because it was at the dealer so much to fix issues. They make no money on any of their cars. All of their cars have very low rent interiors for the price. The Model 3 will be a disaster as far as quality. No Beta testing + no infrasturcture to address the volume of issues that will arise.

They may be worth more than Ford on paper but they are not a viable car company. They have created an EV buzz but they have no leading edge technology in this space. The long term EV market will not include Tesla.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
532 Posts
Tesla is in over their heads. They are ramping up for the Model 3 when they can't even make the Model S, after 5 years, or the Model X. The guy that sold me my Volt had bought a Model X that he was only able to put 400 miles on in 3 months because it was at the dealer so much to fix issues. They make no money on any of their cars. All of their cars have very low rent interiors for the price. The Model 3 will be a disaster as far as quality. No Beta testing + no infrasturcture to address the volume of issues that will arise.

They may be worth more than Ford on paper but they are not a viable car company. They have created an EV buzz but they have no leading edge technology in this space. The long term EV market will not include Tesla.
So you're basing their success and failure on the delivery of a single car with a defect like this? That's some serious foresight you have. Nevermind GM's huge fiasco with their ignition switches that actually killed 13 people and affected over 14 year span of vehicles....14 years...took them that many fatalities and 14 years and 3.4 million cars to admit they have a problem? Really?

I'm no Tesla supporter by any margin but they've accomplished making a car that GM can only dream of being able to do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
135 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
I'm no Tesla supporter by any margin but they've accomplished making a car that GM can only dream of being able to do.
I agree. I think without Tesla we would not have seen the Bolt so fast, and priced at what it is now. If you don't believe me, just look at how ridiculous the ELR was priced at. That's GM marketing showing its true color. ;)

Competition is good, and I commend Tesla for building cars that a normal person would desire and spark interest in EV in general. I wish them succeed, so they can put lots of price pressures on GM and I can get the Bolt/Volt/whatever at a great price! :)
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
19,982 Posts
I'm no Tesla supporter by any margin but they've accomplished making a car that GM can only dream of being able to do.
I assume you are not being serious or mistakenly typed "being able to do" instead of "having a desire to do". GM certainly could outdo Tesla, but as Musk has pointed out, GM has an internal conflict when it comes to competing with their ICE cars. The Bolt EV shows that GM can design and build an EV when they want to. Nonetheless, if they allowed a car to be delivered with a defect like the Tesla Model S, they'd rightly be hounded and derided for it, as should Tesla.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
72 Posts
haha does anyone remember the English imports? Or Italian? I had an Alfa Sud that rusted as soon as it arrived. The gaps between the windows, the horrific low quality steel, the gaps between the body panels. This is so minor compared to the old days.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,230 Posts
I still am having difficulty believing this damage was there on delivery. This means it had to get past any post inspection after receiving from shipping and the detailing crew which cleans up cars for delivery. Considering the size and location how could anyone have missed it?

So post delivery severe body twist by either hitting a mega pothole or going off road and hard swerve back on? If the aluminum is cracked and its determined to be before delivery then all cars of that batch of metal are suspect
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
532 Posts
I assume you are not being serious or mistakenly typed "being able to do" instead of "having a desire to do". GM certainly could outdo Tesla, but as Musk has pointed out, GM has an internal conflict when it comes to competing with their ICE cars. The Bolt EV shows that GM can design and build an EV when they want to. Nonetheless, if they allowed a car to be delivered with a defect like the Tesla Model S, they'd rightly be hounded and derided for it, as should Tesla.
No mistake...if they could they would. GM isn't the type of company that strikes me as one that can easily swallow their pride and sit by saying "if only we had a desire to." GM knows they are going to be caught with their pants down if they don't develop new technology that can compete on many fronts. The way the world is going, it's absurd to think continuing to build wasteful and inefficient vehicles as their bread and butter is sustainable. That's not exclusive to GM by the way, the Germans have an equally idiotic approach.

The Bolt is neither revolutionary or extraordinary. Anyone can stick a 60kWh battery pack in a small hatchback and call it a day. Beyond the range, what exactly does it offer above and beyond any other car in its class?

Tesla's have their issues like any other car manufacturer. The difference is Tesla has developed an entirely new platform and technology in a timeframe GM could never accomplish. It has also developed a car that outperforms pretty much anything on the road.

No one knows how the Model 3 will turn out and time will answer all those questions eventually. However my point is to say that saying Tesla is doomed and going off on a tirade about how it will fail because some idiot in Tesla QA allowed such an issue to pass unnoticed is a bit rich given GM's huge screw-ups as well. To be honest, I have a hard time believing this was a factory QA issue to begin with. It just doesn't make sense to me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
532 Posts
I still am having difficulty believing this damage was there on delivery. This means it had to get past any post inspection after receiving from shipping and the detailing crew which cleans up cars for delivery. Considering the size and location how could anyone have missed it?

So post delivery severe body twist by either hitting a mega pothole or going off road and hard swerve back on? If the aluminum is cracked and its determined to be before delivery then all cars of that batch of metal are suspect
That's my belief too. I just don't see how something like this could pass factory QA. Something doesn't really add up.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
186 Posts
That's my belief too. I just don't see how something like this could pass factory QA. Something doesn't really add up.
Read the TMC thread. The manager of the Tesla certified body shop agrees that the crack existed before factory paint was applied.
 
1 - 20 of 70 Posts
Top