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50 miles AER, no extended range, max speed 65 mph..........

All for only $17,500.00

And ugly..............

Are they kidding????
 

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Dave B,

Good find. It should get very interesting in the next 2 - 4 years, as we see which configurations will really pan out.
Trouble is, I can't find whether it will enter production. We seem to encounter this over and over again...concepts, great in theory, but I sure can't go to any legit dealer and pulunk my cash down on the counter and drive off the lot with my EV. Sucks.

2008 was supposed to be THE year of the BEV with Tesla and Phoenix. Now we're looking at 2009 with Miles and Mitsu. 2010 for GM and umteen other EVs...will any pan out?
 

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Trouble is, I can't find whether it will enter production. We seem to encounter this over and over again...concepts, great in theory, but I sure can't go to any legit dealer and pulunk my cash down on the counter and drive off the lot with my EV. Sucks.

2008 was supposed to be THE year of the BEV with Tesla and Phoenix. Now we're looking at 2009 with Miles and Mitsu. 2010 for GM and umteen other EVs...will any pan out?
Don't forget Fisker.
 

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Take a look:
http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/03/subaru-unplugs.html

This EV is based on the R-1 ICE “kei” (0.66 litre) car Subaru is now selling in Japan and is being road tested jointly by Subaru and Tokyo Electric Power. I saw one (with regular license plate) on the street in Tokyo last month. Even in its current form, setting the ugliness aside, it can be useful for commuting and local delivery purposes (newspaper, pizza, Chinese restaurant, milk…). NEC, the supplier of its battery pack, is the inventor of carbon nanotube, so it is very possible the Li-ion battery pack is utilizing it (Li-ion super cap?).
 

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WOW.. A car even worse looking than the Prius. :p

Chris
I'm at the point that I DON'T CARE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE!
If it is:
1. Electric
2. Range of 40 miles or better
3. Can drive 55/60 mph
4. Backed by a major manufacturer with warranty.
It can look like the Edsel for all I care.
 

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I'm at the point that I DON'T CARE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE!
If it is:
1. Electric
2. Range of 40 miles or better
3. Can drive 55/60 mph
4. Backed by a major manufacturer with warranty.
5. It can look like the Edsel for all I care.
1. Agreed

2. Agreed, but I could even get by with a little less 90% of the time.

3. It needs to be able to sustain 70 to 75 mph to be useful on most major interstates. And have enough reserve power on tap for passing or the rare occasion where flooring it is needed to save your skin, it happens!!!

4. Couldn't agree more, it should have such a good warranty and support that it's almost silly.

5. It needs a broad appeal for everyone and still have a good drag coefficient. The car needs to have a style and personality that will make anyone want to own it. Not to sporty, not to nerdy' but a style and functionality to appeal to the masses.

Personally... I just bought a new car. Traded on my 05 Tacoma and got an 08 Camry Hybrid (loaded). I could have saved about $9K and gotten a Prius, but I just don't like the look of the car. That's just me though... But there are more like me too. And there are more who feel the want you do too... the Volt needs to appeal to as many of us on all sides as possible to make it a success.

Chris
 

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I'm at the point that I DON'T CARE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE!
If it is:
1. Electric
2. Range of 40 miles or better
3. Can drive 55/60 mph
4. Backed by a major manufacturer with warranty.
It can look like the Edsel for all I care.

My specs require 100 miles and 80 mph. Otherwise, I agree entirely. We're getting closer, but it certainly isn't going to be produced by ZAP or sold by Mr. Papp.
 

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Yep, on second thought you guys are right. The ability to go faster is really needed in reality, I am just getting desparate. Interesting that the GM EV1 had a 100+ mile range, and GM is working squeezing the Volt to get 40 mile range 12 years later.
 

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Yep, on second thought you guys are right. The ability to go faster is really needed in reality, I am just getting desparate. Interesting that the GM EV1 had a 100+ mile range, and GM is working squeezing the Volt to get 40 mile range 12 years later.
There's plenty of market share out there for the company that can actually deliver. The MiEV is it, I'm convinced. $24K for that is a reasonable deal when compared to a Volt that is double. The question I have is about availability.
 

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kmb1966:

The EV1 had ONLY a 100 mile range, and that was ONLY in warm area climates. That car was not the great savior that many make it out to be....

The Volt will have a 40 mile AER range at the end of a 10 year life, but still be able to go as far as you want with the built in ICE/Generator. That is a big difference!!!!
 

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kmb1966:

The EV1 had ONLY a 100 mile range, and that was ONLY in warm area climates. That car was not the great savior that many make it out to be....

The Volt will have a 40 mile AER range at the end of a 10 year life, but still be able to go as far as you want with the built in ICE/Generator. That is a big difference!!!!
This is still an unproven technology. Don't forget the maintenance on an BEV will probably be a lot less than an E-Rev. I know the range issue gets people, but one of these days, we're going to see the price of li-ions drop much like megabits in hard drives.
 

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battery prices

This is still an unproven technology. Don't forget the maintenance on an BEV will probably be a lot less than an E-Rev. I know the range issue gets people, but one of these days, we're going to see the price of li-ions drop much like megabits in hard drives.
Battery prices are not going to plunge like computer chip prices. You can't reduce the number of atoms needed to hold electrons in a battery like you can in a transistor. Batteries will get better and cheaper, but they won't get much below $200-300/kwh just on materials costs alone.
 

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Battery prices are not going to plunge like computer chip prices. You can't reduce the number of atoms needed to hold electrons in a battery like you can in a transistor. Batteries will get better and cheaper, but they won't get much below $200-300/kwh just on materials costs alone.
I certainly believe that gas prices and batteries prices are on divergent paths, but I also agree battery prices won't follow computer price dynamics. Even so, Are you thinking base materials cost alone account for $200-300? This seems awfully high, especially if kwh/kg continues to improve. I see the switch from ICE to EV more like the transition from analog to digital copiers. Prices come down some and features improve at the same time.
 

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I agree as well. Battery prices will become slightly cheaper over time while their energy storage capacity will gradually rise. The only way this dynamic will change would be a broadly applicable, technological breakthrough that is fast to production. This is highly unlikely, but not impossible.

I am not at a point where styling doesn't matter. I've stated before that everyone will have their own personal reasons for buying any car. I only hope people make their decisions based on facts, and not misinformation or propaganda. Some may be based on sheer economics, and that's cool. For me, I will only drive a GM vehicle, and I will not drive an ugly car(IMO). I spend too much time in it to be uncomfortable, unhappy, embarrassed, or endangered. Those are my buttons, and the Volt will be perfect for me. Plus, I get to reduce my gas bill. All good for me!
 
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