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Tesla delivered our second Model 3 this week. (We had delayed ordering it until we had a chance to give the first one a test run.) We are really enjoying the cars, I previously posted a review so won't repeat the main points here. A few additional changes to the cars and observations since we bought the first one: Autopilot has continued to improve in the past two months and is really terrific (I use it all the time), the UI has been updated in a number of useful little ways, the car does most of its basic functions automatically (lights, wipers, opening and closing garage door) making the central touch screen only required for nav and entertainment, the efficiency I am getting exceeds the EPA range rating (running around 230 wh/mile on city/hwy). The SC network covers all of our longer-distance driving (driving from Houston to Austin tomorrow, heading up toward Shreveport next week) and is both affordable and fast. There is no reason why, with this range and the SC network, to even think about going back to the PHEV compromise.

I am struck by the astonishing progress on batteries since the original Volt. Our 80 kwh battery pack cost about the same as the original 16 kwh battery packs in our 2011 Volts! Another 20-30% drop over the next 2-3 years looks feasible. Seven+ years ago, when we bought the Volts, I would not have believed that just seven years later we would be able to buy a 300+ mile BEV with more space, far better driving performance, a national fast charging network, and semi-autonomous driving tech for the same price we paid for the Volts. Wow!

I still think PHEVs will have a place among the lower priced vehicles and larger vehicles for another 5-10 years, but I cannot imagine a reason why they would hang around longer than that.

I know there are many frustrated and waiting. The car is worth it! I am giving test rides to anyone who expresses an interest and everyone so far has come away hugely impressed. By this time next year, the waiting and delivery frustrations will be long-forgotten (at least in the US) and we will be seeing these little sedans everywhere. As an owner x2 I can say with confidence that this is a terrific car.
 

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... I know there are many frustrated and waiting. The car is worth it! I am giving test rides to anyone who expresses an interest and everyone so far has come away hugely impressed. By this time next year, the waiting and delivery frustrations will be long-forgotten (at least in the US) and we will be seeing these little sedans everywhere. As an owner x2 I can say with confidence that this is a terrific car.
Nice input and a big congrats.

My son just configured his yesterday and is extremely excited. He has a fairly long highway commute and AP is going to be a perfect fit. They also travel across a few states to see in-laws and are looking forward to that.
 

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How did you get your Model 3s for so cheap? I paid $38,000 for my Volt back in 2012, or about $1,000 more than I paid for my Bolt EV in 2016. The progress has been amazing!
 

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How did you get your Model 3s for so cheap? I paid $38,000 for my Volt back in 2012, or about $1,000 more than I paid for my Bolt EV in 2016. The progress has been amazing!
Sorry I explained this in a previous post. The 2011 Volt fully loaded in black (which was the only thing available - sound familiar?) cost $44,200 including delivery = 49,762 in 2018 dollars. The Model 3 with Premium package and long range battery and delivery cost $50,000. That is why I said it cost the same. If you wait until the 2019 model 3 (like you did waiting until the 2012 Volt) you will be able to buy an LR version for $45k with delivery and the SR for $36k.
 

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I know there are many frustrated and waiting. The car is worth it! I am giving test rides to anyone who expresses an interest and everyone so far has come away hugely impressed. By this time next year, the waiting and delivery frustrations will be long-forgotten (at least in the US) and we will be seeing these little sedans everywhere. As an owner x2 I can say with confidence that this is a terrific car.
Congratulations! and I'm envious.
We just configured a second Model 3 because we each want one. No one wants to drive the Volt. But I'm afraid it will be a few months.
There is no place we want to go that the supercharger network and 300 mile range can't accommodate.
There is just no need for a PHEV at least with a Model 3.

And we keep appreciating lots of little details that are very well thought out.
Such a pleasure to drive. And as you say, people are blown away by how nice it is to drive or ride in.
And as you found the efficiency is terrific as well. We are usually close to the rated range with fast highway driving and modest AC.
 

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Sorry I explained this in a previous post. The 2011 Volt fully loaded in black (which was the only thing available - sound familiar?) cost $44,200 including delivery = 49,762 in 2018 dollars. The Model 3 with Premium package and long range battery and delivery cost $50,000. That is why I said it cost the same. If you wait until the 2019 model 3 (like you did waiting until the 2012 Volt) you will be able to buy an LR version for $45k with delivery and the SR for $36k.
Ah, so you were counting inflation. I guess that's valid.

The very basic Model 3 will be a decent value at that price, but I'm reserving my opinion. We know that the interior will be more basic, but that's not super important. However, having 90 miles less range might not seem like a big deal, but it is. In my opinion, the LR Model 3 is very comparable to the Volt in terms of real-world driving capabilities. The SR Model 3, not so much.

I use my regular 500-mile drives as a baseline for assessing vehicles. In theory, I could make the drive in just under 8 hours in my Volt (7.5 hours driving, 15 minute fuel stop, and a second 15 minute bathroom stop). But, realistically, I'm not going to get out of 8 hours of work just to drive 8 hours without eating, so I usually have an additional 30 to 45 minute stop for food. So typical trip times in my Volt are 8 hours 30 minutes to 8 hours 45 minutes.

In my Bolt EV, that same trip takes about 9 hours 30 minutes (because I get to fold all the eating and bathroom breaks into the charging time). So I am inconvenienced about 45 minutes per trip by taking the Bolt EV instead of the Volt.

The LR Model 3 would (for my typical driving style) more or less match my trip times in the Volt. Based on the efficiency numbers and charging speeds I've seen shared for the Model 3, I'd need to charge for 45 minutes to 1 hour.

Now, the SR Model 3, well we don't have much actual data. We know that it will have much less range (definitely less than the Bolt EV in real-world driving). It will charge faster than the Bolt EV, but Tesla has implied that it will be slower than the LR Model 3. So, while it will likely be a bit faster on my 500-mile trip than the Bolt EV, it would require me to make similar concessions (that the LR Model 3 wouldn't). And for road warriors, the concession would be far more.

I know those 500-mile trips are anecdotal, but I do feel like they are representative of the types of trips that make many Americans balk at the idea of an EV as their only or primary vehicle. So, while we're getting closer, we aren't quite there yet.
 

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Congratulations! and I'm envious.
We just configured a second Model 3 because we each want one. No one wants to drive the Volt. But I'm afraid it will be a few months.
There is no place we want to go that the supercharger network and 300 mile range can't accommodate.
There is just no need for a PHEV at least with a Model 3.

And we keep appreciating lots of little details that are very well thought out.
Such a pleasure to drive. And as you say, people are blown away by how nice it is to drive or ride in.
And as you found the efficiency is terrific as well. We are usually close to the rated range with fast highway driving and modest AC.
I'm headed to northwest MonTana in the future and need one more SuperCharger to simplify it. Hopefully that is in progress as I'm helping with suggestions on locations within Great Falls MT.

I'm currently planning a future trip to UpperP MIchigan and I have to stay at one hotel with a Tesla Destination charger as we are coming back via WIsconson. Haha, normally I never have to plan trips anymore because there are always SCs and the car just maps my route. I just need to determine what town I'm staying in (myscenicdrive.com helps me with some of that).

I'm looking forward to that Canadian highway built out with SuperChargers as I'd likely take a roadtrip across it to MT someday.

Below -- Red open SuperChargers and Grey planned --- Superchargers about 125 miles apart.




125-mile radius circles showing a representative sample of how far Tesla SuperChargers are apart.
220-mile range for Tesla Model 3 Short Range (SR).


 

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I'm looking forward to that Canadian highway built out with SuperChargers as I'd likely take a roadtrip across it to MT someday.
Not sure about the Supercharger network but it's already been done in a Bolt. Not sure of their route off hand but I assume they pretty much took the Trans Canada Highway.
 

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Not sure about the Supercharger network but it's already been done in a Bolt. Not sure of their route off hand but I assume they pretty much took the Trans Canada Highway.
I follow you and understand. I was talking about the SuperCharge network below which many Model 3 SuperCharging events are showing at 110+ kW charging rates when they are a low-med State-Of-Charge. That will be pretty fast and simple for me in a Tesla (son's Model 3 or our X).

Below -- Red open SuperChargers and Grey planned --- Superchargers about 125 miles apart.
 

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Not sure how old that map is but I'm assuming it just shows the Tesla Supercharger network. They don't show the destination chargers for Tesla. They show only one charging station at the North end of Nanaimo which is behind Chapters. I know there are many more not on the map, Google pluginBC. Not sure how a destination charger works (you might have to stay overnight or do they just charge you for electricity used?). With destination chargers you might be able to do it now.
 

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And that's why some of us are not getting invites ;).
Good choice.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Ah, so you were counting inflation. I guess that's valid.



I use my regular 500-mile drives as a baseline for assessing vehicles. In theory, I could make the drive in just under 8 hours in my Volt (7.5 hours driving, 15 minute fuel stop, and a second 15 minute bathroom stop). But, realistically, I'm not going to get out of 8 hours of work just to drive 8 hours without eating, so I usually have an additional 30 to 45 minute stop for food. So typical trip times in my Volt are 8 hours 30 minutes to 8 hours 45 minutes.

In my Bolt EV, that same trip takes about 9 hours 30 minutes (because I get to fold all the eating and bathroom breaks into the charging time). So I am inconvenienced about 45 minutes per trip by taking the Bolt EV instead of the Volt.

The LR Model 3 would (for my typical driving style) more or less match my trip times in the Volt. Based on the efficiency numbers and charging speeds I've seen shared for the Model 3, I'd need to charge for 45 minutes to 1 hour.
I stopped in the Supercharger today in Austin before heading home to Houston. Here is a photo of the screen while I was charging. First time I have ever used a SuperCharger. I got a charging rate of 462 mph, I added 80 miles in 10 minutes. I stayed another 8 minutes or so yapping on the phone and added around 130 miles. I had no idea they were that fast. Cool.

IMG_1721.jpg
 

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I stopped in the Supercharger today in Austin before heading home to Houston. Here is a photo of the screen while I was charging. First time I have ever used a SuperCharger. I got a charging rate of 462 mph, I added 80 miles in 10 minutes. I stayed another 8 minutes or so yapping on the phone and added around 130 miles. I had no idea they were that fast. Cool.
And *impressively* still getting 98 kW at a fair amount over 50% SOC!!!

 

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I stopped in the Supercharger today in Austin before heading home to Houston. Here is a photo of the screen while I was charging. First time I have ever used a SuperCharger. I got a charging rate of 462 mph, I added 80 miles in 10 minutes. I stayed another 8 minutes or so yapping on the phone and added around 130 miles. I had no idea they were that fast. Cool.

View attachment 154521
I think the peak charging rate for the Long Range Model 3 is 115 kW. The 462 mph number might be a bit inflated, though, as most Model 3 owners I've seen have reported real-world efficiency numbers of 3.9 to 4.1 mi/kWh. I have no clue when we will see a Short Range Model 3, but my guess is a peak rate of 90-100 kW.
 

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I think the peak charging rate for the Long Range Model 3 is 115 kW. The 462 mph number might be a bit inflated, though, as most Model 3 owners I've seen have reported real-world efficiency numbers of 3.9 to 4.1 mi/kWh. I have no clue when we will see a Short Range Model 3, but my guess is a peak rate of 90-100 kW.
Higher. From TMC 'TexasEV' his Tesla Model 3 is peaking at 118 kW :

Quote: "Just completed a 2500 mile trip in my Model 3. Every supercharger gave 116-118 kW to start with, and didn’t drop below 100 kW until it was past 50% state of charge. I was very impressed, especially after coming from a Model S 60."

And another user got 119 kW:

 

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Higher. From TMC 'TexasEV' his Tesla Model 3 is peaking at 118 kW :

Quote: "Just completed a 2500 mile trip in my Model 3. Every supercharger gave 116-118 kW to start with, and didn’t drop below 100 kW until it was past 50% state of charge. I was very impressed, especially after coming from a Model S 60."

And another user got 119 kW:

Cool. I wonder if they adjusted it with one of the recent software updates. Most of the max 114-115 kW charge rates I've seen were from 4+ weeks ago.
 
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