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Newbie overwhelmed by FAQs, asking "simple" question (I hope)

12K views 51 replies 22 participants last post by  CcoastVolt 
#1 ·
Apologies if this has been answered, but I don't yet know what I don't know here.

Short story: brand new 2018 Volt (approx 65 miles as I type). While at dealers, energy usage/efficiency was showing 27 of 33 miles were electric for 82% efficiency. Since home, I charged it up fully and went for my first drive (small town back road driving) during which the Flow meter showed engine/gas usage virtually the entire drive. Efficiency has dropped from north of 82% to 43% (to 29 of 65 miles ... so 2 miles have been credited to electric since I left the dealer). It appears substantially all of the time the battery isn't being used at all. Other facts: Engine Maintenance isn't on; hood is closed; and Mode = Normal (though it was switched to Hold briefly by my sales guy at the dealership then back to Normal). I guess I was under the impression the first 45-53 miles of driving would be battery exclusively. Am I mistaken? Is there a setting I missed? Should I do a "reset to factory settings"? Sorry... looks like this was a long story. Any guidance is much appreciated!!

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#2 ·
Your understanding of what should be happening is correct - assuming the car is fully charged. What does the instrument panel show? Have you plugged the car in to charge at some point?

Keep in mind, the 53 miles is if you drive like the EPA test - depending on the temperatures and how aggressively and quickly you drive it can be 50% more or 40% less.

The car will always give you an estimate of how many electric miles you can drive in the instrument cluster, which will change based on how you've been driving.
 
#3 ·
If you are in Normal mode, the gas engine should not come on at all until you deplete the battery (zero miles range).
Easy to verify this by looking at the display. On my Gen 1 the engine is grayed out and when it turns on it is in blue.

The only reason I can think of where running in battery mode would show up as gas miles is if the battery charge were generated in mountain mode by charging with the ICE instead of the EVSE. Is it possible the dealer charged the battery with mountain mode before you took delivery of the car?
 
#4 ·
Saghost: yes, I fully charged the battery yesterday. When I start the cart, the panel initially showed EV Range highlighted with 47 miles remaining and Fuel Range grayed out at 357 range. I saw the same earlier (EV highlighted/Fuel grayed out), but within a couple hundred yards of driving, it flipped to EV grayed and Fuel highlighted. It remained that way for the rest of my short (2 mi) test run around the neighborhood. Understood re the EPA test calcs.
 
#17 ·
Huh. That's not normal. You aren't getting any messages on the instrument cluster when the engine turns on?

Usually, there are four reasons besides hold mode for the engine to come on - Hood Latch, ERDTT, EMM, and FMM.

62F is way too warm for ERDTT (the car starts the engine to warm the coolant for cabin heating at temperatures below freezing.)

Engine Maintenance Mode triggers every 6 weeks if the engine hasn't been run in the interim, running the engine until it gets fully warmed up (<5 minutes) to drive moisture out of the oil and relubricate everything. Your screen shot shows more ICE time than I would have thought EMM required, but you're apparently still getting it.

Fuel Maintenance Mode triggers when the average age of fuel in the tank reaches one year, and runs until after the car is refueled. I guess that could fit for a very early build 2018 that was topped off when it hit the dealer - but there should be an instrument panel message connected to it (I'm not as familiar with Gen 2 car displays; on first generation, all the messages were at the bottom center and it would pop up "Fuel Maintenance Mode" in the message screen when the engine came on.)

And as several folks have mentioned here, if the car thinks the hood is open, it turns the engine on for diagnostic purposes, though on first generation cars it'll actually turn it off once you get up to speed, which doesn't seem to match your experience.
 
#5 ·
Apologies if this has been answered, but I don't yet know what I don't know here.

Short story: brand new 2018 Volt (approx 65 miles as I type). While at dealers, energy usage/efficiency was showing 27 of 33 miles were electric for 82% efficiency. Since home, I charged it up fully and went for my first drive (small town back road driving) during which the Flow meter showed engine/gas usage virtually the entire drive. Efficiency has dropped from north of 82% to 43% (to 29 of 65 miles ... so 2 miles have been credited to electric since I left the dealer). It appears substantially all of the time the battery isn't being used at all. Other facts: Engine Maintenance isn't on; hood is closed; and Mode = Normal (though it was switched to Hold briefly by my sales guy at the dealership then back to Normal). I guess I was under the impression the first 45-53 miles of driving would be battery exclusively. Am I mistaken? Is there a setting I missed? Should I do a "reset to factory settings"? Sorry... looks like this was a long story. Any guidance is much appreciated!!

View attachment 155465
Yeah, that ain't right. Show us a picture of your dash display.
 
#20 ·
No, I don't think confirming Normal mode and topping off the battery would change the fact that some of those battery miles might have been ICE-generated.

But reading the additional posts this morning, it sounds like you should take it to the dealer. Your ICE was definitely running when it shouldn't have been. The consensus seems to be that it is some issue with the hood latch switch thinking the hood is open, and starting the ICE.

At any rate whatever the issue turns out to be, it will be fixed under warranty. This should be a relatively easy problem for the dealer to diagnose. I can understand that as a new owner you felt 'overwhelmed' by the complexity of the car, but in a little while you will feel more at ease. The car is a bit complex but not overly so. Once you understand the driving modes and what the car does in each mode (and what it should not be doing) you are most of the way there.

N
 
#7 · (Edited)
Are you certain the hood is fully close? Pull the hood release lever on the left side of the cabin next to the driver's door, then find the yellow hood release located in the grill just to the left of center. Raise the hood and make sure there are no tools or the hood hold up rod in the way. Lower the hood to ~10 inches and let go (that is how the manual says to close the hood.)

If the ICE is running and the Volt's battery has been charged even a fraction of the total battery capacity there is something that requires servicing. Press the blue OnStar button on the overhead console when your Volt is running with the gas engine powered on and you are in Normal mode. As the OnStar representative to read you any error codes (copy the codes for later for the service department.) If there are no codes ask the OnStar representative to initiate on-demand diagnostics (they can do this) and check for any codes.
 
#9 ·
Perhaps I need to clarify terminology. The ICE isn't running while I sit in my driveway with the car on. It appears to be drawing off the battery at that time and the EV Range side of the instrument panel is lit. When I put the car into motion, EV Range side remains lit for a very short time, then grays out and the Fuel Range side lights up. On the big screen in the center of the car, the Flow meter (not sure of its name) shows the engine lit up (blue graphics) and working most of the time. The electricity from the battery (green graphics) may come on briefly, but not as consistently as from the engine. I'm assuming that because (a) the Flow meter is showing energy coming from the engine, and (b) my gas is being consumed, that the engine is running... but to be honest with you, with my hearing, I can't swear I hear the engine running.

Yes, I double checked the hood and the instrument panel beeped when I re-opened it and dropped it firmly in place. I'll retry just to be sure.

And I'll also contact OnStar... I need to do my initial Welcome Call anyway.
 
#11 ·
There is definitely something wrong if the EV range shows 47 miles and the ICE is firing up (assuming you're not in hold mode). Also 47 miles EV range seems too low for a fully charged, brand new car. Schedule an appointment with the dealer and have them investigate.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Took it for a drive again. Hood appears solidly closed with no obstructions and no warning light it's opened. OnStar ran full diagnostics and found no errors and no codes thrown. I travelled approximately 1/3 mile on EV side, then it jumped to Fuel Range side on panel. Flow showed engine, then EV, and at times it was yellow and showing both were working. Images below are of Flow, Range and Mode while in motion. I'm significantly annoyed, but I appreciate all of your input.

Auto part Speedometer Car Electronics Vehicle
Auto part Vehicle Car Speedometer Measuring instrument
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#13 · (Edited)
There is definitely a problem with the vehicle. The Volt will always default to running on the battery when you start the car, provided there is sufficient battery charge, unless:

The Volt senses that the hood is open, then the gas engine will run. This happens so that the Volt technician can run additional engine diagnostics.

The temperature management system senses that the outside temperature is below 35F or 15F (if engine assist heating set to deferred.) The gas engine will start, Engine Running Due to Temperature message will briefly be displayed on the driver information console. The gas engine will run until the engine coolant reaches 160F, then cycle on and off to provide cabin heat.

You set the mode selector to Hold mode. (Selecting Mountain Mode will not cause the gas engine to start until the battery state of charge is less than 15% (approx. 2 bars)

Depending on your State, you may have the right to return the car to the dealer. If it is not too late, that is what I would want to do. Return the vehicle for another Volt or get your money back.
 
#16 ·
I would actually start with the hood latch and open sensor switch. If the hood shifts up at all while driving the engine will turn on. Since the car is in EV mode until you start moving and then switches to gas mode once it's moving, I would suspect air flow forcing the hood up.

Get it back to your dealership and have them ride along. Use the power management display on the center stack to show the switch from EV to Gas.
 
#18 ·
As just about everyone here has noted, that's not right. Also - when in hold mode, the DIC display changes so not only is the EV range greyed out but the green bars are greyed out as well.

Take it back to the dealer and show them the behavior.

I believe any of the maintenance modes (e.g. Engine Maintenance Mode, Fuel Maintenance Mode, and ERDTT) all show messages on the dash display indicating that they are running.
 
#19 ·
I see lots of mention of the hood switch perhaps being the culprit, and I agree something is definitely not right, but would the dash also indicate the hood isn't completely closed? I know my Gen 1 does but I wasn't sure if there is a position in that switch that would indicate to the computer that the hood isn't latched, but not indicate so on the dash?
 
#22 ·
With only 33 miles on the car at the dealer, almost all in electric, depending on the date of manufacture, it's possible that it has had no gas changes since original delivery to dealer or that the car had not run on gas for more than 6 weeks, triggering fuel maintenance mode (which I understand to be a 5 minute cycle to clear the lines, which comes on when you haven't used gas for some time). It may also be in Engine maintenance if it was an early build.

My first step would be to add a few gallons of gas to the tank and see if that stops the problem. If it does, then what you're experiencing is a built-in feature of the Volt.

Obviously, it is possible that something is malfunctioning, I just thought I might throw out some quicker do it yourself ideas before you head back to the dealer.
 
#25 · (Edited)
My first step would be to add a few gallons of gas to the tank and see if that stops the problem.
That's impossible. If you look at the OP's images of his dashboard, they show that the fuel gauge indicates that the tank is completely full.

FMM, EMM or ERDTT are all unlikely, but a remote possibility. The first thing the OP should actually do is turn the car on and check the info screen (behind the steering wheel) for messages. And see if any messages pop up when the engine turns on. If none do, it's not one of these things.

If it's FMM, it would have to be because the dealer filled the car a year ago and no one has added gas since then. In my experience, dealers keep very little gas in cars until they sell them, at which point they give you a "free" tank of gas. It could be that they almost sold the car, then the buyer changed their mind and the car sat on the lot for a year. But that's very unlikely.
 
#24 ·
It looks like something is off. The car should run purely on battery in the Normal mode. There is a chance of FMM and EMM, but they should not be running that long and that many miles. I had EMM once and it took less than 5 mins for less than 5 miles and consumed very little gas (like less than 0.5 gal).
 
#29 ·
Drive the car for 50-100 miles in one shot. It’s easy to miss the “emm” or “fmm” message on the dash—only pops up for a second. If this is like most Volts, it’s been sitting around for a long time on the lot. Let the car finish whatever it’s doing before wasting time at the dealer. If it’s still doing it after a decent amount of miles, then sound the alarm. If it is EMM, you haven’t given it enough time to finish the cycles. At least rule that out first.
 
#30 ·
Most Volts don't sit at the dealer with a full tank of fuel. At the factory they only put 2-3 gallons of fuel into the fuel tank. For those who have experienced FMM, does this message briefly appear each time the Volt is started until the FMM ends?
 
#32 ·
My first thought was also FMM. I know I had that happen on my 2011 and the message only appers for a very short period of time, I can see how it could be missed. If the dealer can't or won't look at it, I would run the fuel down below half a tank, refill it and then see what happens.
 
#33 ·
Wow, you guys are great! I really appreciate all the analysis and suggestions.

First to mjones21: no, I'm not in Antarctica (though it feels like it sometimes). I'm on the seacoast of NH!

Short story: they believe it's in Fuel Maintenance Mode and I have to burn off at least 1/2 the tank. I have not added any fuel to the car, it's all the dealers.

Long story:
I took it to the dealer this AM. As guessed above, they concluded it was in Fuel Maintenance Mode (FMM). The theory they gave was that the gas in the tank has been there since it rolled off the assembly line in August of 2017... or at least shortly after landing at the dealer. As you know (and I now know), the on-board computer tracks the age of the fuel and if it's old enough, the car will notify the driver it needs to go into FMM. I never saw that notice, but the tech said he found evidence of it.

The manual says if I say "Yes" to "Start Fuel Maintenance now?" in the notice pop-up window, it will begin the process of burning at least 1/2 the tank or more. "The engine will not start until after a short delay once shifted into D (Drive). FMM will automatically continue at each vehicle start until fresh fuel is added." Interestingly, this short delay piece is definitely consistent with what I've been experiencing.

If "No" is selected, the FMM Request screen will appear every time I start the car. The fact I never saw the message makes me think someone before me hit "Yes". I guess it's possible a prep & landing guy, while detailing & setting up the car, hit "Yes" and forgot to mention it to anyone, including me.

So I will drive 'til the tank approaches empty, then fill 'er up and hope for the best. My commute is 53 miles (ironically, given the EPA estimates), so I'll be able to give an update in a day or so.

Thanks again for all the collective insight and willingness to help. It is very much appreciated!
 
#34 · (Edited)
To suspend FMM you don't have to burn the whole tank of old fuel or even half of the tank if you don't want to do so. You just need to add enough fresh fuel so that the average age of all of the remaining fuel in the tank is less than 12 months old. If you drive until the tank is half full and then add half a tank of fresh fuel the average age (old fuel + new fuel)/2 will be 6 months old. You could also do this after you use 1/4 or 1/3rd of the old fuel by adding 1/4 or 1/3 fresh fuel to the 3/4 or 2/3 tank of old fuel remaining. The average age would be calculated accordingly as older than 6 months but less than 12 months. Any of these old/new fuel blends would suspend the FMM. If you don't regularly plan to use the ICE then the owner's manual recommends keeping the fuel tank 1/3rd full (approx. 3 gallons.) So if you decide to use up most of the old fuel, when there is 1 gallon remaining, add 2 gallons of fresh fuel then the average age of the fuel in the tank will be 4 months old.
 
#35 ·
1. do what jcanoe said if you want to get to all electric uses faster and this will prove all is working with the Volt.

2. The gas was free :) just burn 1/2 of the tank - I had to do this and can't say I was happy doing it.

3. There must be an internal flag the dealer can read telling us if the Volt is in "burn-it-all " mode even if this is not an error code flag.

I ran mine to low fuel and re-filled and I had to do one extra restart after the re-fill before all electric started.
My Volt 2012 and may be very wrong but I thought I was getting a message I was in the big burn mode ?

And you can not remove fule easy - some of us have tried -
 
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