[Beezr]

Interesting article today on Motley Fool:

http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2013/06/21/pump-vs-plug-the-true-cost-of-electric-vehicles.aspx

including a link to a relatively new "eGallon Calculator" on Energy.gov...

http://energy.gov/articles/egallon-how-much-cheaper-it-drive-electricity

And an interesting graph on prices of gas vs. eGallon over time...

 

[William George]

I'm not sure the price of gas in the future will be the only important measure. Both cars and power plants will become more efficient. For sure the mpg will go up. But I suspect the potential gain to electricity generation efficiency from shutting down the old coal-fired plants and switching to natural gas will probably make the cost of e-gallons drop even more.

 

[maggiesfarm]

For those of us who use solar to charge our cars, it's even easier. Once we recoup the installation cost of our solar arrays, our charging cost is zero. Now that we have 2 Volts, we're recouping at twice the rate; my Volt, after 19k miles, averages 206 m.p.g., and my wife's ICE has yet to come on.

 

[solar_dave]

For those of us who use solar to charge our cars, it's even easier. Once we recoup the installation cost of our solar arrays, our charging cost is zero. Now that we have 2 Volts, we're recouping at twice the rate; my Volt, after 19k miles, averages 206 m.p.g., and my wife's ICE has yet to come on.

Bingo +1 Once the investment has been taken care of you are good for a long time. My wife whines about the FMM every year LOL

 

[imanjunk1963]

For those of us who use solar to charge our cars, it's even easier. Once we recoup the installation cost of our solar arrays, our charging cost is zero. Now that we have 2 Volts, we're recouping at twice the rate; my Volt, after 19k miles, averages 206 m.p.g., and my wife's ICE has yet to come on.

Ding ding ding ding ...give em a cupi doll. Yes me too. 4.5 yr recovery without a volt since I use the excess to save on heating oil. But soon a volt will be plugged in to enjoy it even more. Already into the 2nd of that period recovery and soon shall be free assuming no production hickups and sudden policy changes of net metering by my util which I think will be highly unlikely in my NE state.
And according to that calculator, 3.70 avg gas price probably 4bucks for the 93 octane costs $1.80 per equivalent...much higher than in so many other states and yet another reason why solar was the right choice to control my own destiny. Now where is my 2014 volt (-;?

 

[Ladogaboy]

Solar tends to be the most universal option because, a vast majority of American homeowners could implement it with great efficacy. But, especially for those Americans living in more remote locations, other options also are available, such as small-scale wind and hydro electric, which both work at nighttime too.

 

[Monzsta]

I'm not sure that calculator is accurate. If it takes $1.20 to charge my volt and I can go 48 miles on that charge how does that correlate? That's 2.5 cents per mile! On gasoline at 38 mpg and $2.22/gal it's 5.8 cents a mile.

 

[siai47]

The calculator is useless. It is comparing a fixed fuel economy car (28.5 mpg) to a similar electric. If you use the same car (Gen 2 Volt for example) and plug in the numbers assuming it averages around 42 MPG on gasoline, the numbers are very close for costs between electric and gasoline. I've done the math before and using "all in" electric rates, generation, utility fees, taxes etc., here in central Florida, on my local utility, the break-even is $2.20 per gallon gasoline. At current utility rates, if the price is lower than $2.20 per gallon, it is cheaper to drive on gasoline, higher, it is cheaper to drive on electric. The real benefit is the quiet and smooth operation of the car under electric power along with zero point source emissions.

 

[CCIE]

I remember when the motley fool was a useful site. It's been a while...

 

[MikeyCVolt]

The calculator is useless. It is comparing a fixed fuel economy car (28.5 mpg) to a similar electric. If you use the same car (Gen 2 Volt for example) and plug in the numbers assuming it averages around 42 MPG on gasoline, the numbers are very close for costs between electric and gasoline. I've done the math before and using "all in" electric rates, generation, utility fees, taxes etc., here in central Florida, on my local utility, the break-even is $2.20 per gallon gasoline. At current utility rates, if the price is lower than $2.20 per gallon, it is cheaper to drive on gasoline, higher, it is cheaper to drive on electric. The real benefit is the quiet and smooth operation of the car under electric power along with zero point source emissions.

I got a similar break-even calculation (also in central FL). Our rates are 11-13 cents per kWH for off-on peak. So going with an average of 12 cents/kWH, I got $2.28 to "fill up" the battery from empty which gets me about 55 miles. A gas-optimized hybrid like the Prius gets similar to that (55 MPG) so I think the break even point is somewhere around that $2.28/gallon of gas. That is, assuming you can live with a Prius. Not me!

Edit: PS, that is using about 19 kWH to fill up the 14 kWH available using a 120 charger. Could probably do a little better than 19 kWH to fill it if I went with L2 charging.

Mike

 

[JRRF]

You have to make this comparison with a car about the size of the Volt, and take into account your actual electricity costs. For me the difference is only about a penny/mile. The equation to drive an electric car is not driven solely by cost.

 

[Ziv]

I average 750 miles a month in my Volt, with around 4% of my miles using the genset. The electricity to get me 720 miles of AER is going to add up to around 235 kWh and night time electricity rate in my area is around 9 cents a kWh. So I use about $21.15 worth of electricity (approx. 192 kWh to the pack and around 38 kWh wasted) and my condo charges me $25 a month for the privilege of plugging in to a wall outlet. Which is cool.
So my fuel bill is $27 a month, & would be $23.15 if I paid what the juice actually costs around here. So I pay around 3.6 cents a mile, and if I could pay just the electricity cost it would be around 3.1 cents a mile. I could drive a Prius the same amount of miles for 4.8 cents a mile (just 33% more) at $2.40 gasoline, but then I would be stuck driving a Prius, which would suck.
On a high heat use day, or on a day when I am driving like a maniac, I can average around 3 miles per kWh, on most days I average between 4 and 5 miles per kWh. Except for Christmas to February 10th or so. Then my electricity use is higher.

 

[MikeyCVolt]

I like that it costs me a little less to operate the Volt but ultimately I bought it for the convenience and the sporty feel of electric drive. If I was going to add up the savings, I'd probably include the cost of more frequent oil changes on an ICE vehicle plus the time it takes for those ~twice a year oil changes and the inconvenience (time is money) of stopping at gas stations which I don't do anymore.

I used to fill up about once a week and out of curiosity, I timed it a few times. It took on average about 7 minutes per stop by the time I turned off the main road, got out of the car, filled up, got back in the car, and got back on the main road. 7x52 = about 6 hours per year at gas stations. Versus just taking the 10 seconds to plug it in when I get home (10 seconds is probably worst case: probably closer to 5).

Mike

 

[JRRF]

Versus just taking the 10 seconds to plug it in when I get home

Plus 10 seconds to unplug it each day

 

[MikeyCVolt]

Plus 10 seconds to unplug it each day

I was being too "generous". More like 6 seconds to plug it in and 4 seconds to unplug it. So I'm still calling it 10.

Mike

 

[JRRF]

I was being too "generous". More like 6 seconds to plug it in and 4 seconds to unplug it. So I'm still calling it 10.

Mike

Today I was more like 7 and 5. Of course I probably killed 15 minutes thinking about it before timing it.

 

[gussack]

Bingo +1 Once the investment has been taken care of you are good for a long time. My wife whines about the FMM every year LOL

What is FMM?

 

[microVOLT]

The beauty of a PHEV like the Volt is you have the choice to use electric or gasoline or both.
In my situation I drive 100 miles a day so a full charge won't get it for me. My electricity is $0.11 kWh and gas is hovering around $2.70/gallon

I can't really charge at work so that's not an option yet.

My daily commute is early morning when the weather is cold around 20F to 30F now so I drive in HOLD mode to take advantage of the gasoline engine and cabin heat.
On the drive home when it's warmer, I drive all electric. If I'm conservative on the throttle and use regen braking I could make it home without using gasoline.
Although, I'm finding out I haven't been able to get more than 45miles out of the battery right now even using ECO ventilation mode.

 

[JRRF]

The beauty of a PHEV like the Volt is you have the choice to use electric or gasoline or both.
In my situation I drive 100 miles a day so a full charge won't get it for me. My electricity is $0.11 kWh and gas is hovering around $2.70/gallon

I can't really charge at work so that's not an option yet.

My daily commute is early morning when the weather is cold around 20F to 30F now so I drive in HOLD mode to take advantage of the gasoline engine and cabin heat.
On the drive home when it's warmer, I drive all electric. If I'm conservative on the throttle and use regen braking I could make it home without using gasoline.
Although, I'm finding out I haven't been able to get more than 45miles out of the battery right now even using ECO ventilation mode.

Isn't the idea to not use gasoline at all?

 

[microVOLT]

Isn't the idea to not use gasoline at all?

No, the idea is to have the flexibility to save money in many conditions.

If you can get gasoline at $1 a gallon and use 1.19 gallons to drive 50 miles ($1.19), it would be foolish to use 14kw of electricity at 11cents/kWh to drive 50 miles.($1.54)


But when it's 20F or colder outside and you have to use cabin heat, you'll be lucky to get 30 miles on a full charge. (electric only would cost $2.57 for 50 miles) This can't be done since the battery will be depleted.

in contrast, using gasoline only will still get you 40mpg when it's 20F. I've been watching it for 2 weeks. If gas is $2 once again (which it won't) that's only $2.38 for 50 miles

In my case, I drive 100 miles per day. Half of it will have to be gasoline no matter what.