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Discussion Starter #1
I'm not the most mechanical guy, but I have my moments when I may need to do repairs to a vehicle. I think we all have this manly urge to go out and putter around. This has been a part of growing up, old cars and apple pie., Make that apple pie and ice cream.

But I can't help but notice how we as owners are starting to be pushed back from being able to do much with our newer cars.
I just ran into this article about John Deere Tractors and how JDeere wants the farmers to be hands off of the equipment.

https://www.wired.com/story/john-deere-farmers-right-to-repair/

I am reading report after report about how TESLA has had this policy for, well, just about forever. The TESLA reports back to the factory through the interweb and if any of those reports hint that the owner has made a change to the car without an "OFFICIAL TESLA TECHNICIAN" having done the work, the car is rendered "UNCHARGEABLE". I did read one report where TESLA actually shut the cars down, they won't even start.
--- There is a video blog on You Tube about a guy that buys crashed TESLAS and rebuilds them back to on the street status. He points out that as long as the Tesla has not reported back to the Tesla factory that it has been in a crash event, the car can still be driven. But if the car has reported a crash event, The car cannot be driven until the factory does a very expensive routine to check and reset systems on the car. The factory will not let out any of the information for a mechanic outside of TESLA to do any of this work and they will blatently shut that car down and the user is unable to get it to run again without TESLAS intervention.
-- It is reported that the first line of TESLAS out of the factory will soon be coming out of warrentee. The warrentee has been the only cusion to protect the owners from the great costs of repairing a TESLA. With the "Look only, don't touch" policy, Teslas will be hitting the used market in large numbers, and for good reason. You cannot repair them yourself.

My interest in the VOLT is always there. This is the most sophisticated car I have ever owned. And it does report status back to GM which as far as I can see, is just that, it reports status of the car. I haven't had a problem with that since GM hasn't tried to apply the "Well TESLA DOES IT" hammer to Volt owners, but it probably should be a concern.

The VOLT, and its sister the BOLT, and probably all the hybreds out there all have their varied levels of sophistication. I have not read a lot of reports where owners have done really heavy repairs to the VOLT. Most likely this is because of warrentees and recalls but can we be locked out as well??

On the hardware side, the VOLT is basically a mechanical thing, just like the old cars barring any updated parts that are unique to the electric vehicle. however the electronics are getting really technically advanced for most owners. I had a speed sensor go bad and asked to have it returned. They said no, it had to go back to Detroit for analysis. Reports of varied repairs come in for the VOLT but in most cases, the repair is always delayed because the parts have to be shipped in from Detroit. They don't keep a large supply of parts for the Electrics in the shop parts coffers. I like to think this is because of the cost of parts but I have found more and more that the dealers simply don't want to be that involved with the electrics, or is it just that it is a new device on the market and it takes time to the knowlege out there, slowly draining down from the GM factories??
- The point is, other than basic mechanical parts in the GM Electrics, and in our case, the VOLT, these basic parts may be accessible to the owners for replacement, if not parts from the dealership (expensive) or parts from the Mans Mall (Lesser Expensive), from a crashed VOLT. As far as I know, the electronics are not user repairable, and we cannot get the tool needed to program the electronics. Up to this point, I have not heard anything about being locked out of the VOLT if an owner attempts his own repair but in the back of my mind I am wondering if GM can actually do this to the volt.

In my mind, no matter how nice the TESLA CONVERTIBLE looks, this lock out feature deems any TESLA a hands off deal. For the cost of a TESLA, I guess you should expect that, or you can afford, to let TESLA do all the work, but to be locked out of any repairs yourself simply doesn't fit the way most would like to deal with car repairs.

Any thoughs????

No, this isn't a poll, no voting.
 

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My Dad used to repair our TV set when it went on the fritz. Do you miss being able to work on your TV set too?
 

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Chevy has a similar thing where if a Volt is in an accident, the car won't start again until a dealer reprograms it. You might say that is different because a really good DIY person may be able to do that. But it is similar. I think a big part of this caution has to do with the danger of the high voltage battery technology, either from fire risk or shock. It is fundamentally different from ICE technology in some regards, and the auto makers don't want their customer base going up in smoke. I don't like unnecessary restrictions to access, but appropriate safety measures are a good thing (exactly where to draw the line will always be debatable).
 

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If you have the knowledge, skill and tools you cam work on you Volt or Bolt. You may need to buy the service manual, you may need to buy and ODB2 device and a subscription to the GM system, but it can and has been done by DIYers.

Tesla's self service lockout is a legit concern, if only for the fact you can't have the car serviced by anyone other than Tesla, ever. People complain about GM dealers, but this seems just a bad to me.

On the other hand, I only do my own tire rotations. I could do oil changes, but I don't. Lights bulbs, stuff like that, sure.

Regarding parts, these are low volume cars. That's a very big part of why it takes time to get a replacement part. Silverado truck parts? Stocked at the dealer or same day delivery. Sales volume makes a big difference.


What I was really hoping this thread would be about is a John Deere using a Volt battery. I have a mid-sized, 4 wheel steer lawn tractor with a 22 HP gas engine. A noisy beast with a 5 foot mowing deck and a two stage 4 foot wide, direct shaft driven snow thrower for winter. I'd love a version that used my 2011's battery (though the battery would be too large for the frame). Mowing or snow throwing takes about 90 minutes, so that 35 mile (EPA) battery would be very capable.
 

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do believe gm tried to do the same thing , prevent non otherized persons from working on the volt
I also believe it was shot down in court , the reason given that it slowed the progression of technology
its a double edged sword. with all the safety features in the car, kinda don't want anyone messing with it
I think having to access gm main computer and it checking to make sure every thing is up to par , is a good compromise on both sides , to insure the vechicle can be turned back on safely. that stored energy in the car, can be lethal , and lets not have that running around in a car that sort of works
 

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Discussion Starter #6
My Dad used to repair our TV set when it went on the fritz. Do you miss being able to work on your TV set too?
and how many tvs have you had stop working lately???? And I am talking GOOD NAME BRAND TVs. Even the old TUBE sets were lasting forever
before the flat screen came in. The old plasma sets did have a fade out problem but just as they found a fix, they were phased out.
The LED sets are pretty cheap and the ones that do go out are simply replaced. Today you can buy a set for around $100 and to replace the screen
will cost you $400. do the math..................................................................................................................
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Adding a battery could be done. You'd add 12 inches in height so you'd be riding like a truck driver, add a CB and you are on your way.....
 

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and how many tvs have you had stop working lately???? And I am talking GOOD NAME BRAND TVs. Even the old TUBE sets were lasting forever
before the flat screen came in. The old plasma sets did have a fade out problem but just as they found a fix, they were phased out.
The LED sets are pretty cheap and the ones that do go out are simply replaced. Today you can buy a set for around $100 and to replace the screen
will cost you $400. do the math..................................................................................................................

My 40" LED stopped working. I did the math. I bought some new capacitors for less than $10, unsoldered the defective ruptured ones (long past warranty), soldered the new ones in. The repaired TV has been working fine for another 4 years at this point.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
do believe gm tried to do the same thing , prevent non otherized persons from working on the volt
I also believe it was shot down in court , the reason given that it slowed the progression of technology
its a double edged sword. with all the safety features in the car, kinda don't want anyone messing with it
I think having to access gm main computer and it checking to make sure every thing is up to par , is a good compromise on both sides , to insure the vechicle can be turned back on safely. that stored energy in the car, can be lethal , and lets not have that running around in a car that sort of works
I posted because I knew TESLA was locking owner repairs out. They are still done but you are better off finding someone that is actually doing it, and there are some out there. They get the parts more or less from Ebay and the MENS MALL. Now that John Deere is locking owners out, this seems to be something that is coming down the pike. 2 companies strong arming you isn't the end of the world, not unless the rest of the market follows suit.

I agree with you. I enjoy my electronics but I wouldn't attempt going into the VOLT. and even if I did, I would have to have some understanding of what it is doing. I have seen some rather hacked up cars in the past. Makes buying a new one all the better.

My Jeep Liberty is a great car, short wheel base, fun to drive but it came from the factory with bad wiring harnesses. I had to by pass one circuit to get functions back. The Joys of Owning A car.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
My 40" LED stopped working. I did the math. I bought some new capacitors for less than $10, unsoldered the defective ruptured ones (long past warranty), soldered the new ones in. The repaired TV has been working fine for another 4 years at this point.
I understand that. I have just about everytype of tv made. The Cathode tube sets run forever. Had an LED fail 30 days out of the box. That was the $400 replacement screen.
The other led sets are hanging in there but a repairman I know said they don't last. He is getting LED sets in that are 1 1/2 year to 1 year old.
I'm told the still existing plasma sets have capacitor problems. They go bad and the set goes down. Modules are still reasonably priced on ebay if you can use PayPal, they won't accept credit card or check????????
There are also cap kits if you can solder carefully and take out the pleathura of screws that hold the set together..
 

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What I was really hoping this thread would be about is a John Deere using a Volt battery. I have a mid-sized, 4 wheel steer lawn tractor with a 22 HP gas engine. A noisy beast with a 5 foot mowing deck and a two stage 4 foot wide, direct shaft driven snow thrower for winter. I'd love a version that used my 2011's battery (though the battery would be too large for the frame). Mowing or snow throwing takes about 90 minutes, so that 35 mile (EPA) battery would be very capable.
Yeah I had a similar thought. Not just me, my neighbors will be really happy if I can have a snowblower or lawnmower with battery large enough for 2-3 hrs. For the snowblower, I might need it to last at least 3-4 hrs for some heavy snow though.
 

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So what happens if Tesla goes out of business? Does that mean that all of the cars are unrepairable by anyone anywhere?
 

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Any thoughs????

No, this isn't a poll, no voting.
Sure. If part of your goal for owning a thing is it being repairable by you, then that's part of your selection criteria. And you should select accordingly. If nobody makes a product new that is so suitable, well, buy used or consider importing from elsewhere. You don't HAVE TO buy a John Deere tractor, you can buy a Mahindra instead, and it's exactly like buying a new tractor in about 1985.
 

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This is the purpose behind the right to repair bills that periodically crop up but never seem to make it to a vote. The other big issue is there is so much software in today's cars that manufacturers are trying to use DMCA to prevent owners from repairing or tuning their vehicles.
 

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So what happens if Tesla goes out of business? Does that mean that all of the cars are unrepairable by anyone anywhere?
I wouldn't worry about it. Some other tech company or car manufacturer would buy up the pieces and assume the warranty work.
 

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My dad has been using the same GE Electrak lawn tractor for 30 years. Thing still runs perfectly and sounds like a vacuum cleaner. Batteries need to be replaced about once a decade if taken care of. You can still find these tractors and they never die.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Sure. If part of your goal for owning a thing is it being repairable by you, then that's part of your selection criteria. And you should select accordingly. If nobody makes a product new that is so suitable, well, buy used or consider importing from elsewhere. You don't HAVE TO buy a John Deere tractor, you can buy a Mahindra instead, and it's exactly like buying a new tractor in about 1985.
I had a similar thouight. What would prevent them from going to another tractor merchant? But then, TESLA and their "No touch" policy isn't all that well known. It isn't really advertised and the only way I found out about it was on a youTub vid from a guy that rebuilds crashed TESLAs.
So that is catching owners on the sly. But even if they know the "No Touch" policy, are they still buying? It's not like there's nothing out there to buy other than TESLA and those alternatives are cheaper. BUT TESLA seems to be pulling customers in anyway and the high price does not seem to thwart the buyers. There are VOLT owners that are on the waiting list as an example.

Yes, it is up to the buyer to decide what he will do about maintenance on a new car. Warantee makes it easy at first but when the warrantee runs out, thats a different matter.

Interesting way things are turning these days.
 

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Me too - Steverino
My favorite ASUS 3d monitor just last week flicked and back lighting went out. ( right in the middle of doing QT federal tax )

Yes it over 5 years old but it is almost always the caps in the back lighting power cicruit.
I have fixed many over the years. Once it was a LED strip.

There is a large business on e-bay of part striped from monitors ( glad to see some are not just put in the trash)

BIG problem for people now if you watch a u-tube fixit video is the " go to your local Radio Shack" and get some new caps.

We have been waiting 6 months for a John Deere tractor part


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Safety:
We don't need a warning ; no one in their right mind would pick up our lawn mower and try to trim their hedge !
 
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