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Discussion Starter #1
Instead of waiting for various energy companies to start building hydrogen stations, GM should start building their own in their targeted markets. The rollout of hydrogen stations is suspiciously slow for such a simple thing, so GM should move to do it to unsure their future vehicles have a market.
 

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Widespread hydrogen refueling stations will never happen. That's why they're called "fools cells". I think eventually even GM will realize that and instead of wasting money on the "fools cells" will divert the funds to advanced battery development which will make the "fools cells" unnecessary.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Widespread hydrogen refueling stations will never happen. That's why they're called "fools cells". I think eventually even GM will realize that and instead of wasting money on the "fools cells" will divert the funds to advanced battery development which will make the "fools cells" unnecessary.
More aptly, only fools call fuel cells "fool cells". If you have been reading up on the latest V2G blogs, you will see that handling the power generation and distribution of electricity for vehicles is daunting at best, and hopeless at worst. Hydrogen may not be as efficient as batteries, but it will have cheaper hardware and be more effective and cheaper to generate, distribute and store than electricity.

The ultimate approach will eventually to have a 40 mile range battery pack with a fuel cell range extender. You'll realize this eventually, unless you are a fool.
 

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Hydrogen is not ready to prime time yet...

There are many challenges with Hydrogen before we will get to the point of building infrastructure. The two toughest ones right now are cost and storage. If you talked about electric batteries 5 years ago you would have gotten a simlar story. Distributing electric power is a challenge right now as well. Electric cars will probably not overstress the the existing grid because much of the additional load will be at night when other loads are low. The new McMansion next door with it's giant air conditioning system will be what brings down the grid.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
There are many challenges with Hydrogen before we will get to the point of building infrastructure. The two toughest ones right now are cost and storage. If you talked about electric batteries 5 years ago you would have gotten a simlar story. Distributing electric power is a challenge right now as well. Electric cars will probably not overstress the the existing grid because much of the additional load will be at night when other loads are low. The new McMansion next door with it's giant air conditioning system will be what brings down the grid.
Not suggesting that GM builds out the nation, but build the stations they need in their target cities to expedite the real world testing of their prototypes. I agree fuel cells are a few years behind Li-Ion batteries, which is why we have gasoline range extenders for now.
 

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How can they do this and earn a suitable return on their investment. May help the market for FCEV's of course, but what I mean is, is there a profitable course in an OEM risking capital specifically on refueling infrastructure? GM has been trying for many years to unload, with the least amount of embarrassment possible, many of the projects they collected during the vertical integration, conglomerate and synergy fads of corporate thinking.

So could a refueling LLC stand alone without the synergies of potentially growing the FCEV market for GM with a respectable return on the funds invested?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
jeffhre,

GM is now doing this in Hawaii, while Toyota, Honda and others are building out their own stations in Japan. It's no longer a question of whether it is necessary, but how effective it ends up being at introducing hydrogen fuel cell vehicles to their early target markets.
 
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