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Discussion Starter #1

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I'm guessing it's not a 300 mile car for less than $30K.
No - I just finished watching the unveil and from what I've found online, they are supposed to be around $180,000. They're pretty, but that's stupid expensive. Of course being a poor college student in my 40's, even a Volt is too expensive or me ;) I also still think the Tesla looks better and I'm not a huge fan of theirs either.
 

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I'm only partway through the video, and I can't get past the Elmer Fudd mashup with a British accent from the first speaker.
 

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Another "pipe-dream" like the Lucid Air. Both of them have no factory yet they talk about production by 2018. The Chinese are really trying to get into this market- trouble is these are cars not phones. Tesla has a 10 year head start and is in survival mode needing the Model 3 to be successful. Other major car makers will have cars by late 2019- neither of these 2 have anything other than one-off concepts.
 

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I wouldn't discount them so quickly. People said essentially the same thing about Tesla 5 years ago (they still say it today, short interest is near all time highs). It is easier to play catchup than it is to be the first. I agree, unlikely that many will succeed, but Faraday and Lucid both have potential. I think Faraday is to resume building their factory soon. Events like the FF91 showing are to get investor interest so they actually have money to do things. Elon is really good at keeping investor interest. They missed delivery estimates and Tesla stock is still up about 5% today. I don't know if Faraday will be as good at that or not.
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Whoa.

370 miles of range per charge, 200 amp DC charging, 130 KWh battery, 2.44 sec 0-60, and did I hear early shipments in March?

I love the looks, not sure about the 70s continental-like reverse opening doors. I'm not sold on this internet connectivity stuff as it seems like fluff. I'm not sure I really need all those sensors and lidar in the car. The kids will love the reclining rear seats. If it comes in at $180k, it's more than what I'm willing to spend on a car, despite the fact that i could dig into retirement money in 8 years to buy one. Shipping in volume in 2018 is really aggressive. If they pull it off, they will out-tesla even tesla.
 

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Good write up. 2 1/2 years to develop and produce 1 Beta Car. GM had the Volt in production in 3 years. A major accomplishment even with their previous EV-1 experience and their vast automotive resources. Now you have 2 companies that have none of those resources trying to convince people that they can not only produce a car but do so in the next year without any of these needed resources to make and more importantly test and QC the components of the car. Lucid and Farady cannot produce a car of the caliber needed. The first Tesla was a Lotus with batteries and it really was a proof of concept not a real daily driver. Both of these cars will have to be built by some Chinese car manufacturer- Who wants to own one of these and pay $180-200K for the privilege.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Good write up. 2 1/2 years to develop and produce 1 Beta Car. GM had the Volt in production in 3 years. A major accomplishment even with their previous EV-1 experience and their vast automotive resources. Now you have 2 companies that have none of those resources trying to convince people that they can not only produce a car but do so in the next year without any of these needed resources to make and more importantly test and QC the components of the car. Lucid and Farady cannot produce a car of the caliber needed. The first Tesla was a Lotus with batteries and it really was a proof of concept not a real daily driver. Both of these cars will have to be built by some Chinese car manufacturer- Who wants to own one of these and pay $180-200K for the privilege.
Well, obviously they are going for the early adopters who want a supercar and can afford it. I'll probably wait for their equivalent of a model 3 (cheaper car for the masses) unless they have a truck or corvette killer in the works. The beauty is that with this platform, they should be able to slap on a different body and adjust the length to make different sized cars. If they don't go overboard with adding bells and whistles (like Tesla's Falcon wing doors) this could get very exciting, very quickly. Now, where's Apple in all this?
 

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Since we don't know what was under the skin of the Faraday roller, they could just have put a skin on a Tesla S.
Conversely, I think faraday's future will lie in providing platforms for other OEMs to bolt their body styles on. They just need to publish a spec, then Chrysler, Mazda, Kia, Subaru, etc can all add electric cars to their lineups. They need help, and not from a young, filthy rich Chinese investor. Their supercar can still be the test mule for all the interoperating systems, but a basic propulsion system sold to other OEMs is probably the only way they can survive.
 

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Well, obviously they are going for the early adopters who want a supercar and can afford it. I'll probably wait for their equivalent of a model 3 (cheaper car for the masses) unless they have a truck or corvette killer in the works. The beauty is that with this platform, they should be able to slap on a different body and adjust the length to make different sized cars. If they don't go overboard with adding bells and whistles (like Tesla's Falcon wing doors) this could get very exciting, very quickly. Now, where's Apple in all this?
And this is where I sort of have issues with these companies. People are already leery of electric cars as it is and it's not helping things any if the companies making them only want to cater to the 1%. Again, I know my income level is not the same as others (poor college student in my 40's), but the biggest hurdle with these cars as it is are their price. Even at $35K to $40K, which seems to be about the average price for the mainstream manufactured cars (Leaf, Volt, etc.), their too expensive for most people. The technology needs to be refined, made a LOT cheaper, and the ranges need to increase. Now don't get me wrong, second hand they are much more affordable. I *almost* picked up a '14 Leaf S yesterday for $7600, but ended up not getting it. The few Volts that I have looked at have been around $15K or so which is more reasonable for the average person. However, buying second hand is also risky due to the high cost of the electrical systems - how many people have the cash on hand to replace a battery pack in these things? I'd rather see these companies focus on a car for the masses to get them more mainstream and then worry about the 1% - purely my opinion.
 

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Conversely, I think faraday's future will lie in providing platforms for other OEMs to bolt their body styles on. They just need to publish a spec, then Chrysler, Mazda, Kia, Subaru, etc can all add electric cars to their lineups. They need help, and not from a young, filthy rich Chinese investor. Their supercar can still be the test mule for all the interoperating systems, but a basic propulsion system sold to other OEMs is probably the only way they can survive.
Well, then, they're going about it the wrong way if they want to create a standard around which other mfrs can brand their own vehicles. I mean, they're going for the ultra-luxe market with the largest battery, the fastest DC motors, etc., etc., etc. To survive, this company needs leadership, and as long as they have an over leveraged billionaire with wannabe issues, I'm not sure they have what they need.
 

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I'm just amazed at the press Faraday and Lucid get. These are not cars that can be produced in volume- no factory. People actually write about them like they are viable car companies which is a joke. They need to learn what Google and Apple have learned- You need to be a real car company to produce a car. Imagine if GM came out with a phone or notebook at CES. The battery updates and design are being done mostly by LG which makes batteries it seems for everyone. Faraday is trying to make a Tesla clone. Given all the troubles Tesla still has, how can anyone really believe that Faraday is nothing more than a design exercise much like Lucid or Fisker or anybody else that thinks they design and produce a car from scratch. By the way I'm taking $10,000 deposits on a car that I am designing that will run on pollution.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
In the original video, I saw the driver door open and close and was wondering if someone snuck in to reboot something.

To be perfectly honest, I really don't want a self parking car - I'm pretty good at parking myself - even parallel parking, backing up a truck with a utility trailer, even hair rack wagons where the front wheels steer off the angle of the hidtch bar. So just give me the looks, range, cargo, passenger room, and not even the speed of the FF91 in a vehicle that Ian;t trying to be an overt-the-top supercar and I'll bite.
 
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