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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I'm not seeing very much info on new Bolt owners lease details. I wonder why that is, usually there are a lot more postings with lease details. Are most people buying them? Maybe people are not thrilled with sharing those high #'s?

If GM isn't careful (and start making attractive Bolt leases), they are going to lose a valuable number of Volt lease return people like myself. I know two other people that are within two months of returning their Volts and want the Bolt but with current lease numbers well above $400 they (and I) are looking at cheaper alternatives like the current (and new, longer range) e-Golf.

The current lease numbers make no sense as you are paying $15-20K over the three year term to lease the Bolt. That's almost 3x of what an e-Golf will lease at. I KNOW it's not a fair comparison but the Bolt is still not worth 3x the money.

GM did a great job with the Volt and gained a lot of new customers that never set foot in a GM dealership prior to leasing the Volt. Now that we have had our run with the Volt (or two of them and 5 years like myself) we see they make a great EV product and want to move over to the Bolt for various reasons (more range, all electric, Volt is too small, etc.). However much we love our Volts we also like low lease payments and can no way justify the MSRP pricing on current Bolts.

Yes, GM has a potentially great product in the Bolt and it's currently in demand it seems. But I would venture to say the extra cash they are going to make on the first Bolt leases/sales by charging MSRP would be easily outweighed by attracting more customers with lower lease rates. People who have pre-ordered are already backing out when their car arrives because of the crazy high lease numbers. I think this is going to continue except for those that have to have the car now.

I'm hoping the current lease numbers don't continue thru the nationwide roll out. If they do you will see me and others jumping ship from GM to other brands for at least three years - and who knows what options we'll have at that time.
 

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Purchasing is really the only thing that makes sense right now. Lease numbers just aren't good at the moment. Minimal discounts compounds that issue. It's pay to play in a seller's market currently.
 

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Purchasing is really the only thing that makes sense right now. Lease numbers just aren't good at the moment. Minimal discounts compounds that issue. It's pay to play in a seller's market currently.
Exactly. Why would GM put incentives on a vehicle for attractive lease options when GM is still ramping supply to try to meet demand. I doubt there will be any good deals on Bolt EV's until details on the 2018 model year are released.
 

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Exactly. Why would GM put incentives on a vehicle for attractive lease options when GM is still ramping supply to try to meet demand. I doubt there will be any good deals on Bolt EV's until details on the 2018 model year are released.
Some people willing to wait may be able to pick up a leftover, bonus tagged, barebones '17 LT this December. If they are even still around. :p
 

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So far GM hasn't lost a sale yet, and you are spoiled by the give-a-way Volt leases from the 2012-2013 time frame. Its a 40K vehicle, do the math on what is common for 3 year depreciation ( near 50% ) and you get the payments expected for a car that expensive. I doubt there will be any deals for at least 6 months, as long as demand is greater than supply, no deals for you. That's how businesses work. For example there are 250K Leaf owners that will be knocking down the doors for Bolts ... that alone will suck up supply for the foreseeable future.

As others suggested, if you want a Bolt, be happy with 1K off and buy one, otherwise you can shop based on lease price and find the next bargain car waiting for you, it won't be a Bolt.
 

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So far GM hasn't lost a sale yet, and you are spoiled by the give-a-way Volt leases from the 2012-2013 time frame. Its a 40K vehicle, do the math on what is common for 3 year depreciation ( near 50% ) and you get the payments expected for a car that expensive. I doubt there will be any deals for at least 6 months, as long as demand is greater than supply, no deals for you. That's how businesses work. For example there are 250K Leaf owners that will be knocking down the doors for Bolts ... that alone will suck up supply for the foreseeable future.

As others suggested, if you want a Bolt, be happy with 1K off and buy one, otherwise you can shop based on lease price and find the next bargain car waiting for you, it won't be a Bolt.
But a VOLT lease sure looks good right now!

Hey, maybe GM actually had a plan for the Bolt and Volt.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
So far GM hasn't lost a sale yet, and you are spoiled by the give-a-way Volt leases from the 2012-2013 time frame. Its a 40K vehicle, do the math on what is common for 3 year depreciation ( near 50% ) and you get the payments expected for a car that expensive. I doubt there will be any deals for at least 6 months, as long as demand is greater than supply, no deals for you. That's how businesses work. For example there are 250K Leaf owners that will be knocking down the doors for Bolts ... that alone will suck up supply for the foreseeable future.

As others suggested, if you want a Bolt, be happy with 1K off and buy one, otherwise you can shop based on lease price and find the next bargain car waiting for you, it won't be a Bolt.
I guess I'm spoiled by the subsidized BMW leases. A $73K MSRP car for $540/month - all maintenance included for three years.

And GM has lost a sale (or three - including myself and co-worker) - not sure where you are getting your data.

"Sad to say we are walking away from our Community Chevrolet Bolt that was just delivered today after posting a $500 deposit in November. They said delivery was expected 12/16 it arrived 1/12 ready for pick up today. After going over the numbers offering $2500 GM rebate and $1,500 down the monthly cost would be $489. Credit Score just under 760. This was on the LT model and the MSRP was $38,800.00 Sorry, not going to do this! :frowning:"
 

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I guess I'm spoiled by the subsidized BMW leases. A $73K MSRP car for $540/month - all maintenance included for three years.

And GM has lost a sale (or three - including myself and co-worker) - not sure where you are getting your data.

"Sad to say we are walking away from our Community Chevrolet Bolt that was just delivered today after posting a $500 deposit in November. They said delivery was expected 12/16 it arrived 1/12 ready for pick up today. After going over the numbers offering $2500 GM rebate and $1,500 down the monthly cost would be $489. Credit Score just under 760. This was on the LT model and the MSRP was $38,800.00 Sorry, not going to do this! :frowning:"
The "lost" sales have likely be replaced by people scooping up Bolts that opened up when the original ordering customers passed. I've seen quite a few Bolts "loosen up" like that get poached by people waiting in the weeds.
 

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In the same boat. My last few cars were BMWs, and the Volt is what brought me to GM. With the payment going nearly double what my Volt lease is, it just does not make sense to stay with a GM, even with it being the Bolt.

My hopes are the leases do drop so it is reasonable in the future to stay with a car that is considerably cheaper than I am used to paying for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
In the same boat. My last few cars were BMWs, and the Volt is what brought me to GM. With the payment going nearly double what my Volt lease is, it just does not make sense to stay with a GM, even with it being the Bolt.

My hopes are the leases do drop so it is reasonable in the future to stay with a car that is considerably cheaper than I am used to paying for.
Exactly! There are many of us just like you in the same situation.

GM has gained new customers, not an easy thing to do - going from German brands to GM, and now they risk losing them and many may never come back. Isn't it better to cultivate these new customers who have a new found respect for GM with a subsidized Bolt lease in an attempt to keep selling them cars in the future. GM can make up the minor costs by selling more SUV's which is where they make money.

People may be waiting in the weeds but when I can order a Bolt for delivery in a few weeks at my local dealership, demand is NOT as great as it would seem.
 

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People may be waiting in the weeds but when I can order a Bolt for delivery in a few weeks at my local dealership, demand is NOT as great as it would seem.
Can you buy one off the lot right now? If you have to order, that validates that there is demand.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Can you buy one off the lot right now? If you have to order, that validates that there is demand.
I will check and see. Being in the SF Bay area that would be a good indicator of demand.
 

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Gen1 Volt, Spark EV and Gen2 Volt were all heavily subsidized and incentive rich at launch with leasing deals...Bolt EV doesn't qualify for anything other than the $250 employee discount and what can best be described as conflicting info to whether or not some of all of the GM point cards do indeed qualify for the Bolt EV and what that max discount number actually is...

What's really interesting is the way GM structures incentives...They seem to like to advertise aggressively "cash back" events or quietly raise their loyal/conquest incentives to $2000 or more...They then like to add the mystery "bonus tags" and even "regional" incentives...This is how folks were getting $50/mo Cruzes in 2015 and $100/mo Equinox's last year....

If you're in a CARB state and qualify for one incentive, not that difficult lease a $34,XXX base LT Volt for $0 driveoff and $200/mo (includes TTL) with the first payment waived...Yet for the base $37,495 MSRP Bolt EV, I'm told an invoice deal $0 drive off and $437/mo...

Credit Score just under 760. This was on the LT model and the MSRP was $38,800.00 Sorry, not going to do this! :frowning:"
GMF caters to the sub-prime market, to currently qualify for top tier (lowest MF/interest) you only need a 620...
 

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I agree. You can definitely buy one in Los Angeles. I'd go to LA tomorrow from San Diego, if I could get it for MSRP out the door. But with even 1k off the price after taxes etc. is around 47k+ for one with msrp of 43500. My volt lease is up in about 30 days, but I'm ready to switch now. If I can't get a better deal I might just buy a Kia I saw at the auto show-Kia Niro. I loved the volt but I want rear passengers to have more space. The Bolt fits that. I'm hoping closer to the end of the month I can get down to maybe 300-500 over invoice with no dealer add ons.
 

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Purchasing is really the only thing that makes sense right now. Lease numbers just aren't good at the moment. Minimal discounts compounds that issue. It's pay to play in a seller's market currently.
With 350kW CCS charging standard being so close to being ratified, purchase doesn't necessarily make a huge amount of sense right now either. Depends on how much you need/use fast charging, I suppose. I'd need it weekly, so I'd be miffed if I bought a Bolt today and the '18's or '19's had 70-, 80-, 100-kW DC charging.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Can you buy one off the lot right now? If you have to order, that validates that there is demand.
I called around to local dealerships. There are Bolts available to take delivery today at MSRP . First dealer I called had 15 to 20 that I could choose from.

Seem to me that if there was great demand for the car they would be some sort of waiting list.
 

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Can you buy one off the lot right now? If you have to order, that validates that there is demand.
I called around to local dealerships. There are Bolts available to take delivery today at MSRP . First dealer I called had 15 to 20 that I could choose from.

Seem to me that if there was great demand for the car they wold be some sort of waiting list.
Or you can look at it with a glass half full view: GM is cranking out Bolts to meet demand.

We'll see how they sold in January's numbers.
 

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Purchasing is really the only thing that makes sense right now. Lease numbers just aren't good at the moment. Minimal discounts compounds that issue. It's pay to play in a seller's market currently.
I never thought I'd see bro advocating purchasing... but it is what it is. It reminds me of how dealerships gouged early Miata and BMW Z3 buyers. Subsidized leases come and go, when sales get soft, the incentives get better - it's all supply and demand.

Of course I'm enjoying my $0 per month, unlimited term, unlimited mileage Volt. Maybe you should consider getting one of those heavily discounted used leafs until bolt prices come down to earth? Or better yet, buy a used volt, only temporarily, and trade it in when you find that Bolt deal. most of the depreciation has already hit the used Volt - it could be very similar to what you are turning in, the difference between buying used now and selling at the end of the year can't be that much, and, if you negotiate like a ferengi, you might break even.
 

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If GM isn't careful (and start making attractive Bolt leases), they are going to lose a valuable number of Volt lease return people like myself. I know two other people that are within two months of returning their Volts and want the Bolt but with current lease numbers well above $400 they (and I) are looking at cheaper alternatives like the current (and new, longer range) e-Golf.
GM might lose customers but they won't be valuable customers. As a business trying to gain sales by discounting is a terrible idea. If people aren't willing to pay for a long range BEV then there is no point in trying to sell them a long range BEV. GM can't sell a BEV with a 248 mile range for the same price as a BEV with 124 mile range. Just not possible. So if people aren't willing to pay more for double the range then they aren't in the target market.

For every lost Volt lessee there are two or more refugees from Nissan or VW who have found that a lower range BEV simply poses too many problems. Or stated differently, your customers have to be willing to pay for what they're getting. If they're not, you need to forget the product or find different customers.

The lease numbers are fine for a new model. The problem is that when you lease you lose all control over the timing of the purchase. Not that this should be determinative, but people need to recognize that it's a factor. My guess would be you'll find the best deals when GM shifts from the 2017 MY, which has a lot of incentives, over to the 2018 MY, which has a lot less.
 

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I never thought I'd see bro advocating purchasing... but it is what it is. It reminds me of how dealerships gouged early Miata and BMW Z3 buyers. Subsidized leases come and go, when sales get soft, the incentives get better - it's all supply and demand.
He's realistic. The best time to lease is when the discounts off MSRP are high. Every dollar of discount you can claim during the first three years. Right now the discounts are minimal and, the way GM structures the leases, you don't get the benefit of the full $7500.

People forget that when the first generation Volt was released we saw pricing above MSRP into the spring of 2011.
 
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