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Sarcasm On:

I wonder what kind of deal Caddy would make me to lease that wrecked POS ELR?????

:)

Sarcasm Off.

Jim - C-5277
 

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My ELR has none of the "issues" mentioned over the past 16 mos. Everyone that rides/sees/glances is amazed.

/Does a Ford have cooled seats?
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
I personally love the cooled seats comment. It cracks me up every time somebody picks an option, and chooses to note that less expensive cars have it, therefore they won't be buying the more expensive car... conveniently ignoring the lack of 40 mile gas-free range and many other features though.

By the same rationale, nobody should ever buy a Tesla Model S. The Cadillac ELR is half the price and has an infinite mile range-extender that the Tesla doesn't even offer.
That's exactly why I got the Fusion instead of the P85D - I could not justify paying $120,000 for a car that didn't have some of the features in vehicles half its price (or in the case of the Fusion Energi, a third of its price). The ridiculous acceleration (that I would never use) and all-EV driving (i.e., finite range) just wasn't enough to make it a better value. I'm immediately saving $60k getting the Fusion instead of the fully loaded P85D I was looking at, and I could never even come close to making up that deficit with fuel savings and tax credits/rebates. And I'll still be driving EV-only for 80-90% of my driving. And frankly, the Model S looks a lot like a Ford Fusion with an Audi front, so I can always pretend it's a Tesla until I hit the accelerator! lol.

My wife, on the other hand, doesn't care about cooled seats or some of the other comforts I like, and she is 100% converted to all-EV driving after owning a Rav4 EV, so she's all ready to grab her P85D (or P100D?) Tesla Model X later this year (or perhaps early next year if Tesla misses its targets, which is likely). I'm sure I'll survive not having cooled seats in it, just as I did in my ELR. But being from snow country in the northeast originally, I will miss them when it's really hot outside here in Los Angeles.

The good news is that in 2-3 years, Cadillac will have a plug-in CT6 that - if the reported specs are accurate - will have everything I want and more. Even if Cadillac tries to charge $80-90k for that car, I'll probably still be game.
 

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The good news is that in 2-3 years, Cadillac will have a plug-in CT6 that - if the reported specs are accurate - will have everything I want and more. Even if Cadillac tries to charge $80-90k for that car, I'll probably still be game.
And then you'll find out that the CT6 doesn't have an automated rear seat cup holder cover, and then we'll have round 2 of the Caddy "Blast"-ing. :p

j/k (.......but not really)
 

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That's exactly why I got the Fusion instead of the P85D - I could not justify paying $120,000 for a car that didn't have some of the features in vehicles half its price (or in the case of the Fusion Energi, a third of its price). The ridiculous acceleration (that I would never use) and all-EV driving (i.e., finite range).
I'm curious why you considered the P85D when you don't care about the acceleration aspect?
I'm glad to hear the Ford fits your needs and wants. But the standard Teslas can be bought much less expensively than the performance model. It seems cost wise, you should compare against the 70D, 85, or 85D. They still loose, cost-wise, but not by nearly as much.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
I'm curious why you considered the P85D when you don't care about the acceleration aspect?
I always buy the top-of-the-line fully loaded model of any vehicle I buy. The P85D had the largest battery for range, and the four-wheel drive holds the road better when it rains or snows. The P85D handled better than the 85D version when I drove it.

Then you add the sound system, AutoPilot, larger wheels, upgraded interior materials, etc. and it really adds up. I did the same thing with the ELR, except I passed on the $2,450 Kona interior and $995 Ruby Red exterior since neither appealed to me.
 

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I always buy the top-of-the-line fully loaded model of any vehicle I buy. The P85D had the largest battery for range, and the four-wheel drive holds the road better when it rains or snows. The P85D handled better than the 85D version when I drove it.

Then you add the sound system, AutoPilot, larger wheels, upgraded interior materials, etc. and it really adds up. I did the same thing with the ELR, except I passed on the $2,450 Kona interior and $995 Ruby Red exterior since neither appealed to me.
Top of the line??? A Ford Fusion??? :O
 

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Top of the line??? A Ford Fusion??? :O
He said "Top of the line of the model".
Your incessant attempt at bullying is making me almost happy I no longer drive a Volt.

Blast, I can understand that. However, you may, next time you are shopping, consider what aspects of car ownership it is that you want.
For example, the added performance of a P85D comes at the cost of range.
The 85D has about 20 more miles of range.

Top of the line doesn't mean better at everything.

In any event, nice purchase, glad you are happy with it:)
 

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That's exactly why I got the Fusion instead of the P85D - I could not justify paying $120,000 for a car that didn't have some of the features in vehicles half its price (or in the case of the Fusion Energi, a third of its price).

..... Even if Cadillac tries to charge $80-90k for that car, I'll probably still be game.

You're not paying $120,000, or $40,000 for anything, you're making a lease payment. You're paying only for the depreciation on whatever car you are leasing, and with money borrowed from the vendor at that. At the end of the agreement, you own nothing. Why keep quoting MSRPs?
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Top of the line??? A Ford Fusion??? :O
He said "Top of the line of the model".
Your incessant attempts at bullying are making me almost happy I no longer drive a Volt.
No worries, Zythryn; 14ELR is just sore that he actually had to pay money for his ELR lease! (lol - I'm just kidding... don't get all riled up!)

It's obvious he's never driven a Ford Fusion Energi, or he would know how comfortable and feature-rich it is compared to the ELR. He's just lashing out from a place of ignorance, assuming that cars that don't look like a spaceship can't possibly be as good as his Batmobile. I totally concede that the ELR looks better than the Fusion, but I'd also argue that the Fusion is quite stylish on the outside. And while the interior doesn't have the panache of the ELR, it's much more functional, intuitive, ergonomic, and comfortable, IMHO. Also, if you don't mind using a fractional bit of gas for each trip, it's faster than the ELR and has more overall range on a full charge/tank. However, the ELR has better traction.

Blast, I can understand that. However, you may, next time you are shopping, consider what aspects of car ownership it is that you want.
For example, the added performance of a P85D comes at the cost of range. The 85D has about 20 more miles of range.
You don't have to set it to "Insane" mode every time you drive it. If you set it to the more economical settings, you'll get close to the same range as the 85D. But if I'm calculating routes where 20 miles would make or break the trip, I'd be doing something wrong, so it wasn't even a concern.

You're not paying $120,000, or $40,000 for anything, you're making a lease payment. You're paying only for the depreciation on whatever car you are leasing, and with money borrowed from the vendor at that. At the end of the agreement, you own nothing. Why keep quoting MSRPs?
I would have bought the Tesla outright if that's what I had chosen. (It's what we're going to do with the Model X when Tesla finally releases it.) But yes, the Ford is leased - you are 100% correct.
 

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I replaced it with a fully loaded 2015 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium. Best car I've owned in quite some time. No complaints whatsoever - everything is done right in that car (aside from the tiny trunk).

I will miss the ELR's Batmobile styling a little bit, but the Ford is still a gorgeous car with sparkly paint that has already elicited some very nice comments from friends and strangers.
I am hoping Ford will step up their game and debut a 200mi range EV soon, I figure the earliest is the LA show in Winter. As for Batmobile styling I always felt the Z4 took that and ran with it. Saw one in an aftermarket black flat finish that just looked amazing. As for the Energi, if I hadn't such a bad feel after my 2013 Mustang I might have looked. I was really hoping for more price movement on the Volt 2 but decided I can wait till the 2017 model year to see a hopeful bountiful quantity of EV and ER EVs
 

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Ah Blast, Blast, Blast, your posts look eerily similar to the all posts you made on this same forum when you were attempting to justify your ELR purchase and it's superiority over the volt.

I didn't lease an ELR, I bought one. I didn't buy it to impress you, or anyone else on here. I bought it because it was the car I wanted (I actually did research on it's features first,) at a price I could afford (after waiting a year for the price to be reasonable instead of impulse buying.) GM has been fantastic, as has the Cadillac dealer I bought it from.

Instead of trying to justify your purchases (and your problems) in life to everyone else, perhaps you might seek in justifying them to yourself and being confident in your own choices without seeking approval of others. It's called self esteem, try it out sometime.
 

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I hope the Fusion works out for you. Annecdotally, a friend of mine bought a Fusion hybrid last year and the car has been in the shop for two weeks recently for a whole bunch of reasons - transmission issue, electrical issues, recall fixes, etc. Every car model can have issues and lemons.
 

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From an ELR to a Fusion. Oh how the mighty have fallen. ( Just kidding, my best friend has a gas powered Fusion Titanium and he loves it).
 

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I was able to check out a Fusion Energi in person this past weekend. I like the overall looks of the car, but that trunk is TINY. That was a deal killer, and why I ended up leasing a C-Max Energi to replace my GMC Terrain instead.

The C-Max offers over 2 times the cargo space compared to the Fusion, and is even roomier inside overall....though the FFE might have better rear leg room spacing. Of course the C-Max is sorta dorky looking, while the Fusion is definitely sleek.
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Anecdotally, a friend of mine bought a Fusion hybrid last year and the car has been in the shop for two weeks recently for a whole bunch of reasons - transmission issue, electrical issues, recall fixes, etc. Every car model can have issues and lemons.
Very true, MTN Ranger. What truly surprised me about Cadillac's offer was that my ELR wasn't in the shop for 30 consecutive days, few of the problems were safety-related, and all of them were eminently fixable. However, after speaking with a couple of corporate attorneys with whom I'm friends, I think I understand what may have happened.

There's a legal doctrine called "promissory estoppel" that allows recovery on a promise made without consideration when the reliance on said promise was reasonable and the promisee relied on it to his or her detriment, such as when a company makes certain promises publicly, in writing, prior to purchase, with no disclaimers, qualifiers, or quid pro quos, and a customer purchases a product based on such representations, and then the company reneges.

There's also "material misrepresentation" - basically, a false statement. This is similar to promissory estoppel, but instead of being a promise, it's a statement of fact that does not bear out and causes some measure of hardship or loss.

What both attorneys told me was that no company will ever do what Cadillac did unless there truly was a material defect that couldn't be fixed (or the company didn't want to fix), or a written promise in its marketing materials that couldn't be honored. They said this sort of thing is rare because most companies will qualify their promises in fine print or footnotes by saying things like "may not be available in every state" or "company reserves the right to modify this feature if necessary" or "for illustration purposes only."

And few companies if any will refund a customer for such a large purchase simply because the product doesn't function exactly as the customer had hoped, because that could be a bad precedent depending on the industry (for example, retailer Amazon.com seems to do this all the time, hence its stellar customer service and satisfaction rating, which helps grow sales and retain customers).

So something I complained about apparently was either an unresolvable defect or a promise made in Cadillac's marketing materials that it couldn't (or didn't want to) fulfill. This is supported by discovering that I wasn't the first person to complain about something related to the ELR who was offered a repurchase.

If I had to guess, I'd say it was the complaint about Cadillac's promise to keep C.U.E. current and release the C.U.E. Collection apps at some point for the 2014 model year, or the poor reverse camera image at night that could expose Cadillac to some measure of liability if a customer relied on it and caused damage or injury due to the unsafe, blurry image.

I really doubt Cadillac refunded my money because the HMI couldn't sort audio tracks properly, or because the screens were too bright (although that too could be considered a safety concern if they distracted from the road). I also doubt Cadillac refunded my money because I complained too much on the GM-Volt forums! lol.

And even though I vented online quite a bit, my interactions directly with Cadillac and GM were much less often. It consisted of me calling once every 1-2 months the point person at GM to whom my case had been assigned and inquiring whether a software update had been released. Every so often, I'd be bumped up to a higher-level person and that would be my new contact. I was assertive, but never acrimonious or overly aggressive, because I assumed Cadillac would eventually release a software patch to fix the majority of issues. I was quite surprised when I got the call saying Cadillac no longer had plans to update the 2014 ELR's software, and that the resolution would be a repurchase instead. I guess Cadillac was pouring all of its resources into the 2016 model instead.

There are a lot of people I know or see online who complain incessantly about this or that product, and usually what happens is the company tells them to hit the road and never buy its products again. Haven't seen any of them get a refund, whether it was a TV, a computer, or a car. So I'm extremely grateful to Cadillac for its exceptional customer service and patience.

To those 2014 ELR owners who love their car without reservation, I congratulate you and am glad you love it. Don't let any of my complaints ruin your experience or tarnish your infatuation with one of the best looking cars on the road. And if you got a great deal, then good on you for that too! We're all happy now, and that's what counts.

Well, everyone except for 14ELR, who seems quite childishly bitter for some reason... no idea what bug crawled up his ass - the dude's only been a GM-Volt member for just over two months yet he acts like he's been suffering through my posts since 2013! I wonder if he knows there's an 'ignore' function on this forum so he doesn't have to read my insightful, compelling, well-written thoughts? Perhaps he just doesn't like it when others complain? See below:

Still nothing but promises from Onstar for me... No results.

I'm glad this is a trial period, because I'd be calling the BBB if I was actually paying for this service (or lack thereof!)
The offstar app has NEVER notified me of a full charge on my ELR...

Let's just go with "Onstar sucks and won't be getting a penny from me once the trial period is up."

Who would actually pay for this lack of customer service?
 

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Poor research on your part, I've owned a volt and an ELR for longer than that. Good job on researching my OnStar complaint. You see that is a service which was not working on the car, provided by OnStar. Remind us again, what item or service on your ELR didn't work as advertised? Oh and How do I choose that block
Your whining option? Lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #39 ·
Remind us again, what item or service on your ELR didn't work as advertised?
I didn't realize you wanted to read this again, but since you asked nicely, here's the short list...

  • reverse camera has poor, blurry resolution at night that makes it nearly useless
  • when the Illumination Control Thumbwheel is dialed all the way down at night, the reverse camera doesn't automatically switch to full brightness when the car is put in reverse, resulting in an even darker, worse image than it already has
  • no setting to disable the incessant triple-honk alert for 'vehicle left on', similar to the available setting to disable the 'keyfob left in vehicle' alert
  • C.U.E. screens too bright at night, even at lowest illumination setting
  • Switching to Night Mode manually doesn't do anything (it's supposed enable dimming the screens during the daytime as if it were evening)
  • after manually turning off the main display, touching any climate control (aside from heated seats) turns the display back on
  • after manually turning off the main display, if you have a destination set, every turn or "prepare to turn" instruction turns the display back on, even though the information is already presented in the DIC
  • poor integration and control of iPod/iPhone devices
  • improper sorting of media tracks (because the HMI indexes the device instead of letting the device control the sorting)
  • inability to display what's playing over Bluetooth in the DIC (even though it can display on the main center stack display, and displays tracks/album info in the DIC for devices connected by USB cable, or playing over the Radio/XM)
  • C.U.E. can't pick up where it left off on an album if such album was selected from the steering wheel controls instead of the center stack display. (C.U.E. instead finishes the song it was last playing and then moves on to the next song alphabetically on the device!)
  • can't access the Favorites bar on the Climate screen
  • A/C always defaults to 'Max' instead of to 'Eco'. No way to switch between 'Min', 'Eco', and 'Max' without first going to the Climate screen.
  • On the Map screen, the 'Destination' icon sets the trip, but the 'Menu' icon cancels it - very unintuitive!
  • No SMS Texting feature that is described in the ELR's owner's manual
  • Passenger door trim blocks a portion of the passenger-side mirror at all driver seat positions
  • C.U.E. will never receive the C.U.E. Collection apps as promised
  • C.U.E. will never stay current with ongoing updates as promised
There's something to be said for a bottom feeder who waits for a premium product to fail so he can grab it at rock bottom prices and then drives around thinking he's not driving a failed model. If you had actually done your research, you'd be first in line for a 2016 ELR, not last in line for a car released in late 2013 with only one production run. But then you probably can't afford the 2016 ELR at its MSRP, even with the $9,000 price reduction.
 

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There's something to be said for a bottom feeder who waits for a premium product to fail so he can grab it at rock bottom prices and then drives around thinking he's not driving a failed model. If you had actually done your research, you'd be first in line for a 2016 ELR, not last in line for a car released in late 2013 with only one production run. But then you probably can't afford the 2016 ELR at its MSRP, even with the $9,000 price reduction.
Seriously? Buying a car that is similar to yours is a bad thing that requires insults?

In my opinion, all of these things are your opinion not 'defects'. Personally, I was never promised CUE updates and don't expect them. Past experience with similar products from many manufacturers suggests that nobody else updates their infotainment products post-sale, so, there is no incentive for GM to do so.
 
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