[Ladogaboy]

Even to this day, I continue to hear the, "Don't buy a non-Tesla EV if you want to drive long distances!" A little over a year ago, a Model S owner even released a video demonstrating how unacceptable long distance travel would be in a Bolt EV (by pretending that his Model S was a Bolt EV).

Knowing how capable the Bolt EV is (and how much more capable it and the public charging infrastructure are than what was portrayed), I decided to do my own video. Only this time, I recreated the trip using an actual Bolt EV. The result was a trip that took the Model S owner 9 hours and 15 minutes to complete took me about 6 hours in my Bolt EV.

Any questions?

 

[Sean Nelson]

I watched your video last night - well done! I really like your presentation with the view ahead and the insets of yourself and your instruments. How do you capture the TorquePro data - is it displayed on the infotainment screen, and if so, how to you rig your camera to record it?

My big question is this: have you ever been stranded by running out of juice? I've watched you in this and some of your other videos with my mouth slightly agape as you drive along nonchalantly with your last bar of charge merrily flashing orange in front of you. You, sir, are made of stronger stuff than I! I've never gotten below 2 orange bars with about 19km (~12 miles) of reported range - and that was when I was returning home to my own trusty charger. I just don't have your faith in public charging stations that I've never visited before.

 

[jcook01]

Watching the video, waiting for the charge, is why I've never considered any plug-in EV other than a Volt.

We've put ~43K on our 2017 Volt, unfortunately only 52% of that has been electric miles...but I've never spent time waiting for a charge. A majority of the non-EV miles were cross country trips.

It is nice though that GM allows one to pick the best fit form vehicle based upon ones' decision criteria.

Practical cross country EV driving appears to be still 5-10 years off from my POV. Range needs to improve and charge times must drop significantly.

Having said all that thanks for the in depth video, I did enjoy the content.

 

[scottf200]

Props for putting yourself out there and doing a video like this as you compare to a Tesla S 60 kWh. It was interesting as I have over 30K miles of roadtripping in Tesla.

Great job with the PiP insets. Too bad you don't have a spare old phone for Torque so you could have displayed it the entire way.

What would be really helpful is if you provided a map of your from, to, and charging waypoints which show the roads you took. It would make it much much easier to follow for people not in your area.

 

[Steverino]

Thanks! Great to watch and see some real Bolt EV data rather than someone without a Bolt doing a "guestimation/simulation".

Regrettably, the midwest is not as built out with public charging stations yet, especially outside regional metro areas.

I have an upcoming trip to Iowa for example that would benefit from having a charge station midway. Tesla does. Of course, over time I expect this will change. "When" is the unknown.

 

[obermd]

Watching the video, waiting for the charge, is why I've never considered any plug-in EV other than a Volt.

We've put ~43K on our 2017 Volt, unfortunately only 52% of that has been electric miles...but I've never spent time waiting for a charge. A majority of the non-EV miles were cross country trips.

It is nice though that GM allows one to pick the best fit form vehicle based upon ones' decision criteria.

Practical cross country EV driving appears to be still 5-10 years off from my POV. Range needs to improve and charge times must drop significantly.

Having said all that thanks for the in depth video, I did enjoy the content.

The recharge time is the current Achilles heel for BEVs, even where the public charging infrastructure exists. I've been cross country three times in the 15 months I've owned my Volt and do NOT want to wait that long for a recharge.

 

[scottf200]

Aside: You would also be a good candidate for contributing to ABetterRoutePlanner (ABRP)

Title: Contributing Driving Data – Bolt EV --- Published by Jason on 2018-08-02
https://abetterrouteplanner.com/blog/index.php/2018/08/02/contributing-driving-data-bolt-ev/

 

[Ladogaboy]

How do you capture the TorquePro data - is it displayed on the infotainment screen, and if so, how to you rig your camera to record it?

I tried the camera way, and it wasn't stable. This is a screen capture software, which is better, but I don't think it is able to capture in real-time (dropping frames).

My big question is this: have you ever been stranded by running out of juice?

Nope. I'd definitely make a video of it if I did because I'm sure some people want to see me get my comeuppance.

Watching the video, waiting for the charge, is why I've never considered any plug-in EV other than a Volt.

You might be surprised to know that my 500-mile trips in the Bolt EV only take me about 30-45 minutes longer than they do in the Volt. After 8 hours working in the office, I'm not ready to drive for 8 hours straight. I typically make one stop for dinner and one other stop for bathroom breaks and to stretch my legs.

To your point (and this is why I think the new Porsche Taycan will be the first, true third generation EV), for your style of driving (and even mine), EVs need to get to a point of adding 3-hours of driving during a 10-minute stop. By default, that also means that my dinner stops of 45-minutes to an hour are still valid. For example, on my 500-mile run, a 300-mile EV that can charge to 80% in 45 minutes would match my typical Volt run. But unless it could also add that same 80% in 10-15 minutes when on a higher power station, 1,000+ mile trips per day will be less convenient than they would be in a Volt.

Props for putting yourself out there and doing a video like this as you compare to a Tesla S 60 kWh. It was interesting as I have over 30K miles of roadtripping in Tesla.

Great job with the PiP insets. Too bad you don't have a spare old phone for Torque so you could have displayed it the entire way.

What would be really helpful is if you provided a map of your from, to, and charging waypoints which show the roads you took. It would make it much much easier to follow for people not in your area.

Thanks, and thanks for the feedback. Yes, I've been considering a map overlay. I'll try that next time.

Thanks! Great to watch and see some real Bolt EV data rather than someone without a Bolt doing a "guestimation/simulation".

Regrettably, the midwest is not as built out with public charging stations yet, especially outside regional metro areas.

I have an upcoming trip to Iowa for example that would benefit from having a charge station midway. Tesla does. Of course, over time I expect this will change. "When" is the unknown.

Thanks! Yes, I'm hoping the Electrify America, fill-in-the-gaps program gets things to a basic, acceptable state for middle America. It's frustrating trying to explain to people: "Look, we don't need chargers where we live. We have those in our garages already. We need chargers on the way to places we want to go."

Aside: You would also be a good candidate for contributing to ABetterRoutePlanner (ABRP)

Title: Contributing Driving Data – Bolt EV --- Published by Jason on 2018-08-02
https://abetterrouteplanner.com/blog/index.php/2018/08/02/contributing-driving-data-bolt-ev/

Yes, they've reached out to be about that. I need to start getting my data logging game online.

 

[scottf200]

Thanks, and thanks for the feedback. Yes, I've been considering a map overlay. I'll try that next time.

RE: map of your from, to, and charging waypoints which show the roads you took

Can you make a simple map and post that here?

 

[Qinsp]

Yes, the first rebuttal against EV ownership by Tesla owners is interstate travel in nearly every EV review. Interstate travel is not common for the majority of cars sold.

Fantasy usage of automobiles by those who are retired or have jobs that allow large amounts of vacation time in blocks, are not based on statistical or civil engineering data.

It seems some folk think there is no difference in usage between an 80 mile EV and a 240 mile EV.

Motorcycles have very short ranges. But range is seldom mentioned. Pickups have can have over 700 miles of range. Again, not a selling point.

But the big point is that range cost money. Heavier batteries require heavier cars and bigger everything. Well except EREVs.

Most car buyers will not spend $50k and up for a car. So does it matter if a $100,000 car will go coast to coast much slower than a $35,000 car when few people can buy a $100,000 but $35,000 in the mean price? If your goal in 2018 is to go coast to coast in an EV (both seaboards are well supported), you are not choosing the right car.

If I bought a $50k EV with a nationwide grid that covered all major highways (not yet available), would I drive to Miami from San Diego? No. Takes too long even in an ICE, longer in an EV.

To cover over 5,000 miles in an ICE hauling a 2,500lb machine, it required 3.5 days. Left Friday AM, returned Monday during working hours. But that's work, not play.

Tesla folk, map this out. Norco, CA to Austin, Texas. We leave Wednesday evening and return Sat afternoon, and stay 2 days in Austin, having fun and racing.

Yes, some folk cannot afford to fly. But that seldom includes folk with $100,000 cars. It's a solution for a problem that doesn't exist for the masses. Our CT6 is a much faster car than a Tesla to do the trip. It has a 400-500 mile freeway range. It will cruise long distances at 100mph. So why fly? Because Time is Money. If you work picking up poop in SF ($71k/yr + benefits), you'd fly.

 

[Ladogaboy]

RE: map of your from, to, and charging waypoints which show the roads you took

Can you make a simple map and post that here?

Sure, let me know which you think looks better. No real editing, just pulled from Google Maps. Oddly, this is exactly how I plan my trips.

 

[Ladogaboy]

To cover over 5,000 miles in an ICE hauling a 2,500lb machine, it required 3.5 days. Left Friday AM, returned Monday during working hours. But that's work, not play.

And that's actually the reason the interstate highway system was built in the first place. It's for hauling equipment, materials, etc. Use as a high-speed transportation system for individual civilians was only secondary.

Bragging about taking Route 66 from Santa Monica to Chicago in 36 hours should be met with a, "Well, what was the point of that?" Road trips used to be about enjoying the trip. We've lost that.

 

[Ladogaboy]

Sure, let me know which you think looks better. No real editing, just pulled from Google Maps. Oddly, this is exactly how I plan my trips.

View attachment 155225

View attachment 155223

I'm not sure why these uploaded with such low quality. They are far better resolution on my computer.

 

[Qinsp]

And that's actually the reason the interstate highway system was built in the first place. It's for hauling equipment, materials, etc. Use as a high-speed transportation system for individual civilians was only secondary.

Bragging about taking Route 66 from Santa Monica to Chicago in 36 hours should be met with a, "Well, what was the point of that?" Road trips used to be about enjoying the trip. We've lost that.

You could spend a few years traveling through California and not see everything that was cool. Nebraska? West Texas? Not so much. Same is true for exploring the Eastern seaboard. It also has good coverage. Just the time-burning flyover states require a lot more coverage. But few EV owners exist there.

 

[scottf200]

I'm not sure why these uploaded with such low quality. They are far better resolution on my computer.

Did you attach them as a thumbnail option? Those are super tiny even when I click on them and I can't read any lettering.

[update]deduced this...
Looks like your from/stop/to maybe:
F: Moorpark, California 93021
S: Selma, Fresno, California
T: 7150 Camino Arroyo, Gilroy, CA 95020

 

[Steverino]

Yes, the first rebuttal against EV ownership by Tesla owners is interstate travel in nearly every EV review. Interstate travel is not common for the majority of cars sold.

While there are those who enjoy taking long road trips for the sake of long road trips, I'm not one of them. Most people I know don't take long trips except for hauling their kid to college with all their stuff. For me, a road trip over 5-6 hours would be where I'd start thinking about flying.

Fantasy usage of automobiles by those who are retired or have jobs that allow large amounts of vacation time in blocks, are not based on statistical or civil engineering data.

My inlaws would drive from Chicago to Florida every summer because one of them didn't like to fly.

Most car buyers will not spend $50k and up for a car. So does it matter if a $100,000 car will go coast to coast much slower than a $35,000 car when few people can buy a $100,000 but $35,000 in the mean price? If your goal in 2018 is to go coast to coast in an EV (both seaboards are well supported), you are not choosing the right car.

Agreed. And most with the disposable income for a $100k car will fly. Heck, most would fly regardless of income.

Yes, some folk cannot afford to fly. But that seldom includes folk with $100,000 cars. It's a solution for a problem that doesn't exist for the masses.

I think the issue is not so much coast to coast travel, but regional travel.

Having a network that supports regional travel would address not only the 80% of commuters who can use a EREV or a BEV on a daily basis, but also those who take longer weekend of week long trips outside of a commute. For me in Chicago that would include Minnesota, Wisconsin, Indiana, Iowa. Of course, that would imply there was essentially a built out national charging network along the interstates.

But to your point, even with that nation-wide network I would rarely if ever use it to drive coast to coast. For me, driving is a means to an end, going from A to B. I don't go out to simply roll around in my car for a few thousand miles. A few do, and that's fine.

 

[scottf200]

While there are those who enjoy taking long road trips for the sake of long road trips, I'm not one of them. Most people I know don't take long trips except for hauling their kid to college with all their stuff. For me, a road trip over 5-6 hours would be where I'd start thinking about flying.
...
For me, driving is a means to an end, going from A to B.

You sure get to see a lot of our beautiful country if you take roadtrips. Something carefree about it as well. You can often visit family and friends along the way. Such awesome memories and fun.

Case in point with a few pictures but a fraction of cool things I saw.
https://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?325887-5500-mile-road-trip-and-95-using-AutoPilot-and-SCs

 

[Sean Nelson]

I tried the camera way, and it wasn't stable. This is a screen capture software, which is better, but I don't think it is able to capture in real-time (dropping frames).

Ah, of course - great idea!

 

[Ladogaboy]

Did you attach them as a thumbnail option? Those are super tiny even when I click on them and I can't read any lettering.

[update]deduced this...
Looks like your from/stop/to maybe:
F: Moorpark, California 93021
S: Selma, Fresno, California
T: 7150 Camino Arroyo, Gilroy, CA 95020

Yes, for what ever reason, the site is reducing 400 kb images to 15 kb. No separate option. Even when I resized to under 100 kb, the site reduced them to 15 kb.

But yes, those were the stops.

Moorpark to Selma: 199 miles (according to Google Maps)
Spent 55 minutes charging in Selma, from 3% to 65% (1 hour including slop time)
Selma to Gilroy: 132 miles
Arrived with 3% battery and spent 28 minutes charging before heading on to ChargePoint Headquarters in Campbell

Just under 6 hours 26 minutes of total time start to finish, with just over a 51 mph average trip speed.

*Note. This trip is a bit different than Alex's, starting about 30 miles farther out but ending about 15 miles closer. Given the flack I've been getting from Tesla owners crying foul, I might have to redo this trip one of these days from Alex's actual starting point. People seem to focus on the fact that I arrived with 3% battery instead of the fact that, had I started where Alex started, I would have been arriving with 15-20% battery. I don't know why people are so self-conscious about another company building a capable long-distance EV. It's some sort of weird cognitive dissonance. Or maybe normal cognitive dissonance.

 

[hellsop]

I don't know why people are so self-conscious about another company building a capable long-distance EV. It's some sort of weird cognitive dissonance. Or maybe normal cognitive dissonance.

It's like they're very invested in their car choice being the only good one.