all of these stories are the same. they just keep regurgitating the same thing over and over. never in history has a new car with unconventional technology been expected to climb to the top and stay there in the blink of an eye........

are they so blind they can't see it's obvious they are a pawn in attempting to minimize this technology? there are very, very powerful forces out there that stand to lose hundreds of billions of dollars when this type of automobile becomes the norm. it appears they will continue this game until they lose all creditability because this technology isn't going away this time. if it was just gm like last time it would be different but that's not the case. let them keep pandering to the willfully ignorant base. in the end they are only damaging themselves.

 

A point of view to be sure.

We shall see if the conclusions ring hollow in the next few years as the price of gas inevitably climbs ever higher.

I'm just glad that I could buy and keep an electric vehicle this time unlike the EV1

 

The one glaring problem with EV 'haters' and EV 'not-on-board' type people are that they say nobody is buying them and they're not "taking off".

But then they cannot define what "taking off" means.

Everyone wants fast results, quick growth, fast adoption - or it's dead. They are used to millions of iPods being sold, then iPads, then whatever else someone sticks in their pocket. That's not the case with a whole swing of technology for vehicles.

An EV buyer must:
1) trust the technology
2) understand the technology
3) know what electricity as a fuel means per mile (dollars, kWh, charge time, fuel displaced)
4) know that they will need to possibly install a ESVE at home for 220V charging (maybe)
5) know that they will be discussing their decision with friends/family/strangers
6) know that they 'enter the battle' when buying an EV and that there will be many nay-sayers along the way they will deal with
7) commit to at least a 3-year romance with the vehicle through lease or multi-year through purchase
8) consider the tax credit as part of their thinking process and if they cannot receive it, may wait it out for prices to fall (but they're stil on board)

When you buy an ICE:
1) you go in and bicker about price, sign the lease or loan or pay cash and then drive home.

It's not easy comitting to a whole new technology.

This EV movement DOES NOT HAPPEN OVERNIGHT. But it's here now, with 1500+ cars sold per month (Volt+Leaf+Karma+iMiEV...) in the USA alone. Leafs selling worldwide now over 20K units. This is not the end but the beginning.

Pundits cannot look at a graph until it is played out to completion. Intelligent people know how to look at a graph and say "it's beginning". So, forget the pundits and keep on going. The EV movement is happening - just not at some rate that pleases those who are not participating.

Didn't all this happen back with the first Prius hybrids and the pundits said "nobody is buying them"... ? Weren't more-wealthy greenies buying Priuses due to their higher prices? Today, who benefits most of the electrical efficiencies of EVs? Lower-paid workers who could benefit from the lower cost of electricity over gasoline. But the initial price of EVs keeps them out of the market. PRICE is the key, early adopters are helping establish the technology and drive further price reductions and the snowball is now rolling.

http://www.plugincars.com/2012-plug-sales-already-flop-111651.html

The unrealistic expectations of media who are used to the millions of units of iPods just have unrealistic expectations.

I'd be happy to see 15,000-20,000 Volts sold in the USA this year. This means about 10,000 Leafs, 500+ Karmas, bunch of BMW active-e's and Mitsubishi i-MiEVs and whatever else is out there. This year, we may see close to 40,000 EV and EREV vehicles sold. That's "not taking off"??

 

I read somewhere that the Volt in it's first year outsold the Prius in it's first year. If this is true, that's all I will tell people that want to say the Volt isn't selling. The Prius is a big success now...and in a few years, I hope (and expect) that the Volt will be a big success.

 

This is true. 1st year sales of the Prius were 5,600 in the US - the Volt exceeded that by almost 40%. 2nd year Prius sales were 15,600 and the Volt should stomp on that. 3rd year sales of the Prius were basically 20,000 and I'd hazard a guess that, barring an unexpected recession, the Volt will easily exceed those US sales as well. 4th year sales of Prius's were 24k. Prius sales didn't exceed the 2x,000 range till the 2nd generation vehicle in 2004 (5th) year.

Couple of things to keep in mind - the Prius was a much cheaper car (had a temporary tax break) and it was 80% of the hybrid market - the Volt as we know is about 50% of the plug-in market with the Leaf being most of the rest. Combined the Volt and Leaf are crushing the Hybrid market takeup for the first year and will for the 2nd year as well (and probably the rest of the way on out).

In the context of Hybrid's and the Prius - the Volt, despite being much more expensive, is doing much better than they did. Plug-ins in general are doing much better than hybrids did.

 

What I got from the article was that expectations were set too high for the Volt by both Chevrolet and the government.

The best strategy now would for the Volt to be a limited production halo product like the Corvette.

 

Why set your goals down below your ankles..............we all know the Volt deserves more than that.

If you look to the stars and dream BIG, you might put a man on the moon some day.........OMG, did that already happen?

 

The Prius sold about 40k cars total through the first 3 years of production. The Volt should easily beat that.

 

This reminds me of all those years when almost everyone bought Windows computers because they made financial sense. Apple's superior machines were too expensive and "out of the mainstream." Well, most of the people I know have switched to Mac, our Apple stock has gone up, and the future is now on that end. People are curious about the Volt, GM doesn't know how to market it, and I'm just going to hope the evolution takes place again. Driving a Volt is like using an iphone. Pricey, a leap of faith, but the best thing going.

 

Friends,

You are being far too kind in your assessment of the article.

The author, Edward N., is a notorious GM and Volt troll. You might as well try to have a reasonable Volt discussion with Rush Limbaugh. Leave 'em both be...

 

...and the obvious follow up question is why did the OP post it? One of bloggers for this site said something to the effect that they are keeping a close eye on the motivation of posters around here to root out trolls.

Well hello!!! Wake up and smell the coffee.

 

What ticks me off is people driving $60k+ BMWs and Lexi blabbing that the Volt is too expensive... Seriously?!

I am the last person that used to be considered a GM fan, especially after what the company did to the EV1. "Who Killed the Electric Car?" angered me immensely and only cemented my anti-GM view. I've only had one American-made car before, a Ford Probe GT (really a Mazda MX6 underneath) that I dearly loved. All my other cars have been Japanese and a German. I had surrendered to the status quo.

And then I had a revelation. I saw the production prototype of the Volt at the 2009 Philadelphia Auto show. It was on a turn table, roped off and sitting motionless. I could almost touch it, it was real, it was there, it was GM's grand and yet humble apology, a sign of grace most unexpected from a giant corporation ridden with the proverbial tone-death malaise.

And then came the moment when I looked myself in the mirror and thought, this is a defining point in your life, this is your chance to do something that is important, that matters. You can no longer be a bystander and just talk about it. You need to be a part of the solution. You have a responsibility to lead people that will follow and show them that they should not be afraid of the electric car. If a schmuck like me can drive one, so can they.

The Volt is a tremendous success for the people that matter the most, the ones that drive one. It is the rightful heir of the EV1, it has moved people and made an Impact It has etched a milestone in automotive history. No one can take that away as hard and as relentlessly as they try.

 

Nice thoughtful comments guys. You have said it all already. The only thing I would add is that people need to keep in mind the oncoming CAFE and CARB +14 other states PHEV/BEV requirements. When reality finally dawns, the industry will realize that this type of technology is the ONLY way to get there. By then GM will be so much farther up the learning curve than everyone else that the only way for the others to catch up will be if GM falters. God forbid!

I agree with vdiv at #10. We are all doing our bit to help to make history IMHO.

 

The point I think he has right is that it does seem like management is not having a steady hand on the rudder. Completely agree with those who believe that the quality and attributes of the car -- those things which give it the highest satisfaction score -- will eventually prevail over the political or technical noise.

I followed MichaelM's advice and looked at the author's other posts. Not entirely clear but it appears he's in the "full EV with Better Place" camp. Given the technological issues I honestly don't know why anyone thinks Better Place will work but the idea has managed to attract a following.

 

Wow.

Some folks here certainly have bought and pounded down the Supersized 40oz Vast Right Wing Conspiracy Flavored Kool-Aid, and mixed it with a Red Bull chaser. Maybe even some Jaeger.

I fail to see where the author unfairly bashed the Volt in or took some oxy-crazy Limbaughian Anti-Volt positional rant.

He is faulting GM for playing politics with the Volt, much like the perceived Voltemies or Voltfans. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't, but I can't believe that GM NEVER played the Volt for a political advantage at some point. The last four years have been crazy from any standpoint, certainly GM's.

The following sentence basically sums up his article, and I don't really know how anyone looking at the Volt from a rational open-minded viewpoint could disagree with it:

The basic problem with the Volt isn’t that it’s a bad car that nobody could ever want; it is, in fact, quite an engineering achievement and a rather impressive drive. And if GM had said all along that it would serve as an “anti-Corvette,” selling in low volumes at a high price, nobody could now accuse it of failure.

Anyone that passed a entry level marketing course in college could see that a $40,000 Chevy will not sell 60,000 units in its second year of production. Tax credits don't matter, 5 cent KWH electricity doesn't matter, 4 dollar gas doesn't matter ($10 gas would matter)- its just what Joe Sixpack sees when he looks at the window sticker and says "WTF! 40K!" I know, because I did that, before I drove it, researched my options, and rationalized and talked myself into buying one.

Look at his graph. At the current rate, a few months out, demand and supply should intersect. That could change based on gas prices or some other event. GM is wise not to want 40k Volts sitting all over its dealers lots. Harley Davidson thrived on hard-to-get bikes during the 90s and early 2000s. All bikes were sold on a waiting list and MSRP plus. Buyers wanted a Harley BAD, and they would do or pay almost anything to buy a $20,000 vehicle with two wheels.

This guys 'rant' is far more rational than some of the posts I've seen on this board. I believe this board is rapidly approaching the point where the signal to noise ratio here is surging to the point where soon no one will glean any useful information in their purchase decision or info on for 'how to live with my Volt". Too many threads are simply summarized in "The evil Oilies are killing our Precioussssssss Volt. My Preeeeeeecccccccioussssssss!"

I hate to say it, but I see things here becoming similar to the Appleloonian cult, where anything remotely negative said or perceived slight against the One True Faith, will inspire riots and post-fests in the comments section of the offending heretical party. Maybe a few burnings-at-the-stake are in order too! Onward crusading Voltians! Save the World from their evil carbonic ways!

If anything, his "Twilight of the The Volt" headline was a juicy honey pot placed in clear view of those wearing the Viridian Joule-tinted sunglasses. Oooooh! Think of the hits he's getting. The advertisers will be most happy. Mr. Niedermeyer is probably sitting at his computer, laughing his arse off.

I bought a car, as a car guy. I didn't buy a political statement, and certainly didn't intend to.

 

I think this article is right on the money. GM had unrealistic goals fueled by the government's unrealistic goals.

Unfortunately for the naysayers the Volt is an excellent car and the EREV concept is very solid. As word gets out, fuel prices rise, Volt prices fall, and the technology becomes more accepted, Volt sales will grow organically year after year much like the Prius did.

Someday it will seem foreign not to plug your car in at night, much like it feels weird to me to drive a car without regenerative braking these days.

 

I love the comment "seriously underperforming to expectations..........";

whose expectations? Surely not the current owners expectations.........maybe all those that have never driven a Volt?
I know they are referring to GM people BUT isn't it a little early to presume what GM's full expectations really are for the Volt?

The writer of this article should know because their website name is "The Truth About Cars"......how real is that.

 

Sorry, 60,000 new $40,000 subcompact cars of any type from any brand is difficult, let alone one with a brand new propulsion concept that most people don't understand. That's the quantity GM initially claimed they'd sell in 2012. The DOE report on the car claims 120,000 Volts will be sold this model year.

I don't think BMW sells that many 3 Series models in the US every year and that's an established brand with decades of good reputation.

GM needs to be realistic about this car and its sales. Due to their unrealistic goals the media jumps all over any inkling that the car won't sell 60,000 units a year (then 45,000 units a year, then "building to demand").

Instead of being able to say "We sold six times more electric cars in 2011 than we sold of the EV1 over four model years!" the headlines are all "GM misses Volt sales target." If they're not careful, the headlines next January won't be "GM Doubles Volt Sales!" but instead "GM only sells 1/3 of targeted Volt sales."

It's gonna take a minute for this technology to catch on. This is an expensive car that's confusing to a lot of people, just like the Prius was in 2001. Those stacked up on dealer lots too, initially. I remember that well as I was in the market for a car then and there were many Prii to choose from, in all colors, at all dealers, in eco-nuts Los Angeles.

Toyota took the long view, let's hope GM is doing the same.

 

10K first year - came close.

Doubling is hard to do, so 19K to 21K US-sales for '12 would have been a good "posturing" number - any more would be cream.
In that mix, say 6-8K Amperas on top of 19-21K Volts. That's pretty substantial. 100% YoY sales increases are only normal with new hot models such as the Cruze or Sonic.

Remember, year two does not include all the hard-core "I want one" folks from year-one early adopter purchases. What is good is that gas prices will approach $5.50/gallon in California this year, imposing a higher demand curve.

I wonder if they couldn't do certain union agreements or plant work unless enough units were "advertised"?

In the mean time - increase the Volt allocations to Canada. The people in Quebec are really saying there is a market for cheap hydro-fueled cars in a currently $5.50+ gasoline market.

 

Right, doubling a product's sales in its second year is VERY hard to do. The volt is on track to nearly triple.

Of course with all of GM's loud-mouthed stupid prognostication the Volt TRIPLING sales for calendar 2012 would be a failure. They need to shut up and let the product speak for itself while continuously improving it.

 

Good discussions, all.

Ed N. was calling the Volt a "Lemon" in the New York Times -- in July 2010 -- 5 months before it went on sale.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/30/opinion/30neidermeyer.html

Another (more circumspect, IMHO) view of the current Volt situation can be read at:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203986604577257681918603106.html

although the objections of a Davis, CA couple who chose a Prius are, at best, uninformed. The article closes with "There are some really good things happening and we are going to keep that momentum," Mr. Reuss said.

Ever notice how the "Flaming Fireball of Death" is already fading from memory? A few months of strong(er) sales will do much to shift the Volt's image toward the positive.

 

3D reverse vision is 20-20.

The author is basically trying to 'explain' Volt's sales performance by criticizing GM's vision of what Volt is all about in an historical view. I can see where speculating that 'we'll sell 60k in 2012' was a bad move on GM's part. However, four years later calling that a failure is pretty harsh.

Remember when Volt was born, gasoline prices hit an all-time high. There were lots of things being speculated upon in 2008. Had the gasoline price trend prevailed to $5 or $6/gallon, maybe Volt sales would have been much better. Or maybe we would have been in a deep financial depression and no cars of any ilk would sell.

We're in the first inning still. There are lots of pitches before we find out how may GM hits out of the park or how many strike-outs. We won't know until it is historical information on some guy's trend chart.

I'm opining that this chart is too short to forecast a future trend. Volt only hit national roll-out last fall. Let's wait a bit before we pronounce the end of Volt's run.

 

sorry for the double here.