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Surprisingly, libs have been very silent about their innermost desire to force everyone into mass transit, but this one tipped his hand too early:

Link

Every one of libs social experiments have failed, but they will never concede that they are wrong, so they are going to continue to do everything they can to force the rich to live amongst the poor.

In reality, people are going to spend more money to keep their independence - happily paying for a PHEV or PFCV.
 

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The twin evils: Godless communism abroad & liberal humanism at home.

Every one of libs social experiments have failed, but they will never concede that they are wrong, so they are going to continue to do everything they can to force the rich to live amongst the poor.
Is mass transit a social experiment?
Because if it was, it certainly was'nt a failure.
In fact, there were quite a number of non-libs who worked very hard at destroying the so-called failed experiment of mass transit.
Don't take my word on it...feel free to click on the link I'm providing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_American_Streetcar_Scandal
 

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Surprisingly, libs have been very silent about their innermost desire to force everyone into mass transit, but this one tipped his hand too early:

Link

Every one of libs social experiments have failed, but they will never concede that they are wrong, so they are going to continue to do everything they can to force the rich to live amongst the poor.

In reality, people are going to spend more money to keep their independence - happily paying for a PHEV or PFCV.
Long-time lurker, first time poster here. Just wanted to drop a friendly line to let you know that your avatar and post caught my attention. Either you're doing a decent job of continuing Colbert's lampooning of a bias-blinded right-winger spewing truthiness, or the irony of your avatar and post content combination is totally lost on you. Pretty interesting either way you are playing it.

Keep up the good and/or ridiculous work!
-Nuttzy :cool:
 

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Surprisingly, libs have been very silent about their innermost desire to force everyone into mass transit, but this one tipped his hand too early:

Link

Every one of libs social experiments have failed, but they will never concede that they are wrong, so they are going to continue to do everything they can to force the rich to live amongst the poor.

In reality, people are going to spend more money to keep their independence - happily paying for a PHEV or PFCV.
YUP!!!
You hit the mark right on the head.
 

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Is mass transit a conspiracy of libs? When I was living in the NY suburb of Great Neck (a rather rich village) I used to take the LIRR train to go to my showroom in Manhattan, and drive to my warehouse in Long Island City. I wasn’t forced by libs to take the train. It was faster and more convenient. Many of my fellow passengers were rich lawyers, businessmen, bankers, storeowners etc.

Take a look at the following subway map of Tokyo:
http://www.toshiweb.com/0-rosen.html

Only a small percentage of the 10 million residents there use their own cars to commute. Most of them, very rich as well as very poor, take trains, which come and go every 2 minutes to 15 minuets. In addition to this subway network, there are bus services all over. Cars there are for mostly recreational purposes. I do not think people there equate car ownership to freedom. They always have the freedom of choice, mass transit or privately owned automobiles.
 

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Mass Transit Would Be Freedom

If we had a much better mass transit system we would have much more freedom. We are losing a lot of our freedom because we are using and require so much oil from the Middle East, Russia, Mexico, Venezuela, and many others. We have used up most of our domestic oil long ago. Let that be a lesson to it is scarce and I don't think we can explore and find enough oil anywhere in the world that will meet all our demand, China's, and India's demand. The only way is to have more transportation choices. This includeds mass transit as well as personal electric cars and trucks. Remember the fact that in many cases Money = Freedom. We are giving our money to everyone else in the world.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Here is my recommendation for a mass transit system. Unlike those "people mover" type systems which circulate people around a city, I propose a system similar to railroads and airlines, that would ship both people and freight at high speed, but much greater efficiency.

If we created large evacuated cylinders, in which a mag-lev train could be propelled with little or no wind resistance, we could transport freight and people as fast as jet planes, but more efficiently than locomotives. There is a German company that makes large air handlers for ventilating mine shafts, which could be arranged in series to drop air pressure in these cylinders well below atmospheric pressure. Mag-lev systems are common, so a new one would be devised for extremely high speeds.

These systems could be placed between cities, and even ferry your vehicles, if you planned long trips. At those high speeds you could easily cross the country in 6-8 hours, depending on the number of stops.

This would greatly reduce the amount of air freight and travel in this nation, and hence, would reduce all that fuel burned. It would also cut down on "global dimming" - the reduced sunlight experienced as a result of the water vapor produced by jet aircraft.
 

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having mass transit as a cheap, safe, efficient, and convenient alternative does not force anyone into using it.
 

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The majority of travel done in the United States is less than 40 miles daily. I do not think we need to go jet speed for 40 miles. Most of our gas consumption is done daily during our commutes to work. A mass transit system should try to accomodate that. Most mass transit systems are very expensive. Probably the best mass transit system is a monorail because they don't require land (they can be built next to/ on top of a road and are fairly quick and use electricity. However they are very expensive. I really think our focus should be on clean and renewable energy and changing our our cars, truck, and suvs to electric. Once on electric we can search for ways to get cleaner.
 

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The majority of travel done in the United States is less than 40 miles daily. I do not think we need to go jet speed for 40 miles. Most of our gas consumption is done daily during our commutes to work. A mass transit system should try to accomodate that. Most mass transit systems are very expensive. Probably the best mass transit system is a monorail because they don't require land (they can be built next to/ on top of a road and are fairly quick and use electricity. However they are very expensive. I really think our focus should be on clean and renewable energy and changing our our cars, truck, and suvs to electric. Once on electric we can search for ways to get cleaner.
Would you car to define expensive. Roads, gas, cars/person, repairs for millions of people for 30 years ain't exactly cheap. Try costing out adding one lane in each direction to a major highway. Running costs for an automobile average more than 50 cents/mile. I believe we should have long ago commited to better mass transit in amenable metro areas. Good private transportation is important, but good public transportation is equally important. South Florida has behind in road construction for 35 years and will ALWAYS be behind and getting further behind. Infrastructure is a LONG term investment, whether it be in mass transit or road building and either way it is government funded. Mass transit is many times more cost effective per dollar spent, but it is more restrictive.
 

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Mass transit is many times more cost effective per dollar spent, but it is more restrictive.
I should have written "mass transit can be many times more cost effective per dollar spent, but it is always more restrictive."
 

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I wish someone would push us to have the kinds of transportation systems others around the world enjoy. Just makes traveling so convenient. I do feel it would be extremely difficult to do in America. The culture would need a complete turnaround. In other countries you will see very successful people riding public transportation as a part of their daily routine. I don't know about America because even I don't want to use our systems. ;)

I feel the only way we will get good public transportation in the mid-term would be if all of our oil dreams come to an abrupt end (peak oil turns out to be true) and people simply cannot afford personal transport. In that case people will need a way to get to the work camps and to buy their gruel for the day.
 

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I wish someone would push us to have the kinds of transportation systems others around the world enjoy. Just makes traveling so convenient. I do feel it would be extremely difficult to do in America. The culture would need a complete turnaround. In other countries you will see very successful people riding public transportation as a part of their daily routine. I don't know about America because even I don't want to use our systems. ;)

I feel the only way we will get good public transportation in the mid-term would be if all of our oil dreams come to an abrupt end (peak oil turns out to be true) and people simply cannot afford personal transport. In that case people will need a way to get to the work camps and to buy their gruel for the day.
The dirty little secret about Europe (The land of all things perfect and sensible) is they bought 15,958,871 cars last year. About the exact same as we did. If mass transit is so ideal and Utopian, why would they buy all those cars that cost lots more to acquire and keep than they do here?? Bottom line, people like their freedom and nothing beats the automobile for personal transportation. To wish the end of oil just to get us into mass transit at personal sacrifice is just dumb. A much better idea is just to invent automobiles that run on something other than oil. That's happening now as we speak. No need for extremes.
 

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The dirty little secret about Europe (The land of all things perfect and sensible) is they bought 15,958,871 cars last year. About the exact same as we did. If mass transit is so ideal and Utopian, why would they buy all those cars that cost lots more to acquire and keep than they do here?? Bottom line, people like their freedom and nothing beats the automobile for personal transportation. To wish the end of oil just to get us into mass transit at personal sacrifice is just dumb. A much better idea is just to invent automobiles that run on something other than oil. That's happening now as we speak. No need for extremes.

Of course we all realize the world is bigger than Europe (I would need to see your data to see if there is a correlation between the car purchases in Europe and the use of public transport). How about check out Asia or very crowded cities around the world. Great public transportation is a must. Cars are sitting in traffic and the cost to park (if you can find a space) is over $15 for the day. There are several places I would not own a car. NY City is one of them. If done correctly public transportation is wonderful and I enjoy using it and the freedom it gives me. Yes, I said freedom. Waiting in endless traffic, putting up with cab drivers and searching for parking is not my idea of relaxation. On the train I can read or take a quick nap and be sure to be where I want to be within minutes of my expectation. Additionally, I wonder if a study was ever done but I think that people who use public transportation are less prone to obesity. Why? You have to walk to the different platforms and stops. I enjoy the walk and stay in much better shape than when I only have to walk 30 feet to my car. Why not have both? Use public transportation when it makes sense (like going into the city for the day) and then use a renewable energy car when that makes sense. If the weather is nice why not take your bike?
 

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How about check out Asia or very crowded cities around the world.
If you're talking about mass transit and Asia, you must be talking about Japan. Japan has a population of about 127 million people and last year they bought 5.35 Million cars, so a little over 1 out of every 23 people bought a new car. By comparison, we have about 301 Million people and we sold 16.14 Million cars, meaning a little over 1 in 18 people bought a new car last year. So we are consuming more cars than they are, but there do seem to be an awful lot of car sales for a country with such great public transit. I suspect that there are a fair amount of folks riding the train with new car brochures in their hands dreaming of the open road.

Why not have both? Use public transportation when it makes sense (like going into the city for the day) and then use a renewable energy car when that makes sense.
Having both is a great idea except we don't want to pay for it. Public transit systems never seem to make money and always need to subsidized or run by the government. If they were money making propositions, we would see rail lines springing up like condos. So if we want more trains and buses, we have to raise taxes. The people speak their choice with their pocketbook.
 

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If you're talking about mass transit and Asia, you must be talking about Japan. Japan has a population of about 127 million people and last year they bought 5.35 Million cars, so a little over 1 out of every 23 people bought a new car. By comparison, we have about 301 Million people and we sold 16.14 Million cars, meaning a little over 1 in 18 people bought a new car last year. So we are consuming more cars than they are, but there do seem to be an awful lot of car sales for a country with such great public transit. I suspect that there are a fair amount of folks riding the train with new car brochures in their hands dreaming of the open road.


Having both is a great idea except we don't want to pay for it. Public transit systems never seem to make money and always need to subsidized or run by the government. If they were money making propositions, we would see rail lines springing up like condos. So if we want more trains and buses, we have to raise taxes. The people speak their choice with their pocketbook.

You have never been to Japan I take it. The public transportation system is just a part of life there. The whole place would come crashing down if it stopped tomorrow. If you went there and spent some time there you would know this. You also didn't know that the Japanese have to buy a new car every 5 years or so. If they don't they have to pay huge fines every year afterward. This not only keeps the economy going because they are buying new cars the main point is for them to always have the newest technology on the roads. The place gets cleaner every year. Check it out.

I can understand if you have only used the mass transit systems in America you would be jaded. Like I said before, I have no desire to use American public transportation other than in big cities like NY City.

Oh, you think the only revenue that public transportation generates are the fees? Do you think the only revenue our interstate system generates is the tolls? I don't think people clearly understand the concept of national infrastructure and how it enables a country to generate more business. I hope you don't think the statue of liberty is only good for the ticket revenues visitors pay.

It's clear that we are on different ends of the Earth (literally) on many issues. That's cool with me. Cheers!
 

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I live in a city, Calgary Alberta Canada, that does not have a very great public transportation system but is used fairly heavily. Our downtown core is fairly congested with motor vehicle traffic and parking is at a premium. Parking your vehicle downtown will cost anywhere from $15 to $35 for the day or $4/hour at a meter. The transit system (light rail transit) runs every 5 minutes during peak hours and is jam packed with people going to or leaving the core. More commuters ride the LRT into and out of the core everyday than drive. I wish we had a better system and I couldn't imagine what it would be like without that system in place.

We also have shuttle systems for commuters from surrounding commuties (30-50 miles away) so that they can leave their vehicles at home and take a bus into the city instead of driving. I think this service works pretty well since it's still running.

I usually visit Europe every 3 or 4 years and the only way I travel around there is by using there public transit system. This includes light rail in cities, buses to small centres and trains for longer travel between cities. I think they have an excellent system although it's a little more complicated than I'm used to but does the job.
 

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You have never been to Japan I take it. The public transportation system is just a part of life there. The whole place would come crashing down if it stopped tomorrow.
I have never been to Japan, but I'm well aware of how integrated the public transit system is in Japanese daily life. It's this kind of dependency that alows the French railway unions to just go on strike and get what ever the hell they want.

You also didn't know that the Japanese have to buy a new car every 5 years or so. If they don't they have to pay huge fines every year afterward. This not only keeps the economy going because they are buying new cars the main point is for them to always have the newest technology on the roads.
You're right, I didn't know that the Japanese had to buy a new car every five years because it isn't true. Nobody in Japan has to buy a new car. You can keep a car as long as you like there, they just start to tax the crap out of you the older it gets. This just illustrates my point even more. In spite of such a wonderful mass transit system, people are choosing to purchase new cars at great personal expense. People just like transportation independence.

Oh, you think the only revenue that public transportation generates are the fees?
Well, here's the thing. Any city in America is free to put in what ever transit system they like and if those cities could look across the pond and see a great economic boon or people turning a nice profit, they would have no problem convincing voters to pony up the money to build them. There's no big conspiracy, just simple economics and a undeniable truth that we are a nation of individuals and we like our independence very much. This makes mass transit a tough sell here. I'd love to have a great mass transit system in place just like Europe, I just won't pay for it and neither will most Americans.
 
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