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Did anyone else watch this video? Everyone knows the debate about where you get the electricity from. But at the beginning of this video the EPA states that "may cause adverse respiratory, pulmonary, and neurological effects to those exposed." In regards to nickel and cobalt cathodes used in Li-on batteries. It goes on and says other stuff to.

Check this video out, what do you think?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztvf3zrJJXQ
 

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The video seems to argue that pollution is the only issue. Agreed that it should be one of the issues, but it is far from the only. I also consider the SOURCE of the energy to be very important. For example, if I can switch from a gas powered car to an electric, for the "same" level of pollution, but the energy source is 100% domestic, I consider that a win.

The video also seems to assume 100% coal in its analysis. Here is a helpful site from the US government on where your electricity comes from. http://www.epa.gov/cleanenergy/energy-and-you/how-clean.html While I am in an area about 70% coal, there is still 30% that is not coal, pulling down the overall level of pollution. Further, I do about 90% of my charging at night when the power companies do not have to run the more expensive, and higher pollutant level coal generators as much.

Lots to factor in to any thinking or argument on this....
 

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People are not zero emission (and I won't start on cows) but the arguments in this video have been spoken to before on this site and others. I have also seen that a gallon of gasoline takes about the same amount of electricity to refine and deliver as a full charge on a Volt. So that would mean every ICE car is using the same amount of electricity as a Volt but is also using gasoline.
 

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The video seems to argue that pollution is the only issue. Agreed that it should be one of the issues, but it is far from the only. I also consider the SOURCE of the energy to be very important. For example, if I can switch from a gas powered car to an electric, for the "same" level of pollution, but the energy source is 100% domestic, I consider that a win.

The video also seems to assume 100% coal in its analysis. Here is a helpful site from the US government on where your electricity comes from. http://www.epa.gov/cleanenergy/energy-and-you/how-clean.html While I am in an area about 70% coal, there is still 30% that is not coal, pulling down the overall level of pollution. Further, I do about 90% of my charging at night when the power companies do not have to run the more expensive, and higher pollutant level coal generators as much.

Lots to factor in to any thinking or argument on this....
I mostly agree with what you're saying, but wanted to say that I always thought the coal/NG facilities burned a constant level of coal 24/7 and used NG to supplement during peak demand because it's much easier to scale those systems up and down...
 

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I mostly agree with what you're saying, but wanted to say that I always thought the coal/NG facilities burned a constant level of coal 24/7 and used NG to supplement during peak demand because it's much easier to scale those systems up and down...
Coal plants are typically what's referred to as "base load" power plants. They run pretty much constantly because it takes days to shut down and restart. So yes, in that sense you are correct, but they don't necessarily produce the same amount of power at all times. They can be throttled up and down to an extent, just not as easily as a NG turbine.
 

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I mostly agree with what you're saying, but wanted to say that I always thought the coal/NG facilities burned a constant level of coal 24/7 and used NG to supplement during peak demand because it's much easier to scale those systems up and down...
This is one reason why I prefer not to use public charging during the day. I don't want to put additional stress on the grid during peak hours. I prefer to charge at home, at night, when there is plenty of excess capacity on the grid (and when the rates are best :) ).

One more advantage for the Volt in my opinion.
 

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But at the beginning of this video the EPA states that "may cause adverse respiratory, pulmonary, and neurological effects to those exposed."
This video is bull****. The EPA didn't say anything of the sort. The guy is trying to make it sound like just sitting in an electric car can lead to these health risks. In reality, all he's talking about is what would happen if you ground up the battery and inhaled it or ingested it.

News flash: most parts of any car would be unhealthy if you ground them up and ingested them.

These risks may be a legitimate concern for the workers who assemble the battery (although I doubt they have any significant exposure anyway), but they have absolutely nothing to do with Volt owners, drivers, passengers, etc.
 

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People who argue these fine points don't "get it". Going electric flips the whole transportation energy game on its head. Electricity isn't an energy "source" like oil, gas, coal, nuclear wind, or solar. It is an energy "currency" that we can generate from myriad sources and use for myriad purposes. It's been that way for over a century. EV's just add automotive transportation to that mix. Electrifying the transportation sector (including rail) gives us the OPTION to control what we want for our transportation energy sources - solar? put up some PV panels. Nuclear? Fracked shale gas? Wind? Sewage gas? Coal? We can be as renewable or as polluting as we collectively decide - EV's give us freedom from petro-slavery.
 

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People are not zero emission (and I won't start on cows) but the arguments in this video have been spoken to before on this site and others. I have also seen that a gallon of gasoline takes about the same amount of electricity to refine and deliver as a full charge on a Volt. So that would mean every ICE car is using the same amount of electricity as a Volt but is also using gasoline.
Your are correct. Gasoline consumers only see what is in their gas tank. The processing, transportation, storage, and retail sale of gasoline all use energy, and all generate secondary emissions. Gasoline and Diesel are primary emitters, since they are burned in the engine, and are only partially burned, which mandates the use of catalytic converters and other additives.

Pure electricity is the cleanest and most convertible form of energy into other forms. The main problem is storage.
 

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John McElroy is very right wing. Best to treat him like Mark Modica and ignore him. I'm not quite sure if he knows he's misquoting the studies or if he's just too biased and dumb to understand the studies, but what he says the studies say and what they actually say are never remotely the same.
 

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This video is bull****. The EPA didn't say anything of the sort. The guy is trying to make it sound like just sitting in an electric car can lead to these health risks. In reality, all he's talking about is what would happen if you ground up the battery and inhaled it or ingested it.

News flash: most parts of any car would be unhealthy if you ground them up and ingested them.
Everyone knows that swallowing or inhaling gasoline or motor oil is perfectly safe. Really. No cancer risk at all. No risk of fire either. Treat it just like water. :)
 

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People who argue these fine points don't "get it". Going electric flips the whole transportation energy game on its head. Electricity isn't an energy "source" like oil, gas, coal, nuclear wind, or solar. It is an energy "currency" that we can generate from myriad sources and use for myriad purposes. It's been that way for over a century. EV's just add automotive transportation to that mix. Electrifying the transportation sector (including rail) gives us the OPTION to control what we want for our transportation energy sources - solar? put up some PV panels. Nuclear? Fracked shale gas? Wind? Sewage gas? Coal? We can be as renewable or as polluting as we collectively decide - EV's give us freedom from petro-slavery.
Beer farts.
 

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All pollutants are created equal; some pollutants are more equal than others.

The core of the argument is true: EVs might not be zero-emission. However, that is very dependent on how you define and breakdown the argument. For those who have renewable energy sources installed, their EVs might be emissions free. Unless, you try to backtrack and state that emissions were released during the creation of those renewable sources. Basically, there is no end to where you could take the argument, and as long as you focus only on the segment that supports your sensational views, you have the basis for a misguided piece of journalism.
 

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Well, since the Koch Bros and other people associated with Big Oil are money-laundering hundreds of millions of dollars through various right wing-nut organizations to spew FUD propaganda against EVs, plug-ins, hybrids and climate change since it threatens their business model---then maybe Mr. McElroy is also on the take?

This particular FUD propaganda by the right wing against EV/Hybrid batteries and the carbon footprint of these vehicles has already been thoroughly debunked by real scientists as the garbage propaganda that it is:

http://www.plugincars.com/electric-...ncludes-wall-street-journal-op-ed-126685.html

or here:

http://www.environment.ucla.edu/media_IOE/files/BatteryElectricVehicleLCA2012-rh-ptd.pdf
 

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Did anyone else watch this video? Everyone knows the debate about where you get the electricity from. But at the beginning of this video the EPA states that "may cause adverse respiratory, pulmonary, and neurological effects to those exposed." In regards to nickel and cobalt cathodes used in Li-on batteries. It goes on and says other stuff to.

Check this video out, what do you think?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztvf3zrJJXQ
Even if you get 100% electricity from coal, an electric car is going to have a lower carbon footprint. People forget that for all the advances in ICE technology over the last century the average ICE is still less than 20% efficient at converting oil to movement. Even the best economy cars are barely 25% efficient. Check out a documentary called "Carbon Nation" it's free in various places on the internet.
 
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