[BAZINGA]

I knew it was lurking, bought our 2017 Aug 20th 2016. Have driven over 7400 miles and only have 50 miles on the ICE. VoltStats reports I'm operating my Volt at 99.3% all electric. My other two Volt's (2012 and 2013 driven over 45K miles) but they never needed a FMM. So today I get the FMM message and accept it. I have about 5 gallon's of gas in the tank. So I have one question and one observation.

Question: How much fuel will be burned off, all 5 gallons, a percentage, how much?

Observation: I know the door label shows my car was built 06/16, but since the FMM chose today to run, can I assume my car was "built" or given birth on June 22nd 2016, 365 days ago? I say that because there must be a clock/calendar built into the car and someone had to write the code to make this work and it makes sense to say "365 days from TODAY start FMM on the day the car registered fuel being added". Thoughts/comments.

 

[llninja]

I've never seen FMM on my volt, but alas, my volt hits the Dino juice almost daily with my 50 mile commute. Though today, with mild weather I did park at a free charging station 2 blocks away. All electric today, unless I decide to take a side excursion for some shopping.

 

[Barry]

I'm not the expert on FMM, but I think the mode does not stop after burning a certain amount, but after you add a certain amount of fuel. It think the amount you have to add is enough to lower the average age of the fuel to 6 months, so I guess that would be an amount equal to whatever is left in the tank when you begin to add fuel. Subject to some minimum amount that I think is about 1.5 Gallons.

Also, I think the number of days is not exactly 365, but within a few days of that number. And it may not have been fueled the same day it was built.

 

[jcanoe]

Question: How much fuel will be burned off, all 5 gallons, a percentage, how much?

Once FMM starts the Volt will start to burn all of the fuel in the tank, i.e. 5 gallons. You can reduce the amount of fuel that will be consumed by FMM right now by mixing fresh fuel with the old fuel. The Volt will compute the average age of the fuel ((age of old fuel * gallons of old fuel in tank) + (age of fresh fuel * amount of fresh fuel added))/2.

It all depends on how much gas you are comfortable having sit in the fuel tank. If you allow FMM to use up 2.5 gallons of old fuel, starting now, and then purchase 2.5 gallons of fresh fuel, FMM will be suspended with 5 gallons of a mixture of 50% old fuel and 50% fresh fuel in the tank. In six months the Volt will ask you to allow FMM to run again.

You could suspend FMM right now by filling the fuel tank with 4 - 5 gallons of fresh fuel but then you would be carrying a full tank of fuel in the Volt when you regularly need to use only minimal amounts of gas. In this case too, in six months, the Volt will ask you to allow FMM to run again.

Since you normally use so little gas you may want to allow FMM to burn up all of the fuel in the tank (get the amount of old fuel in the tank down to less than 1/3 or 1/4 gallon) and then add 1.5 gallons of fresh fuel. That amount of fuel should last about a year with Engine Maintenance Mode running for about 10-15 minutes once every 6 weeks. Then, a year from now, you would purchase another 1.5 gallons of fresh fuel.

I keep my Volt's fuel tank between 1/3 and 1/2 full because I like knowing I have 125 - 200 miles of ICE range. I don't wait for EMM to run once every six weeks. I use Hold mode and run the ICE engine for about 8 - 10 miles every two weeks to circulate the fluids and and to fully heat up the engine oil to 190 F + to drive out any moisture from the engine.

 

[BAZINGA]

Once FMM starts the Volt will start to burn all of the fuel in the tank, i.e. 5 gallons. You can reduce the amount of fuel that will be consumed by FMM right now by mixing fresh fuel with the old fuel. The Volt will compute the average age of the fuel ((age of old fuel * gallons of old fuel in tank) + (age of fresh fuel * amount of fresh fuel added))/2.

It all depends on how much gas you are comfortable having sit in the fuel tank. If you allow FMM to use up 2.5 gallons of old fuel, starting now, and then purchase 2.5 gallons of fresh fuel, FMM will be suspended with 5 gallons of a mixture of 50% old fuel and 50% fresh fuel in the tank. In six months the Volt will ask you to allow FMM to run again.

You could suspend FMM right now by filling the fuel tank with 4 - 5 gallons of fresh fuel but then you would be carrying a full tank of fuel in the Volt when you regularly need to use only minimal amounts of gas. In this case too, in six months, the Volt will ask you to allow FMM to run again.

Since you normally use so little gas you may want to allow FMM to burn up all of the fuel in the tank (get the amount of old fuel in the tank down to less than 1/3 or 1/4 gallon) and then add 1.5 gallons of fresh fuel. That amount of fuel should last about a year with Engine Maintenance Mode running for about 10-15 minutes once every 6 weeks. Then, a year from now, you would purchase another 1.5 gallons of fresh fuel.

I keep my Volt's fuel tank between 1/3 and 1/2 full because I like knowing I have at least 150 - 200 miles of ICE range. As a rule I don't wait for EMM to run once every six weeks. I use Hold mode and run the ICE engine for about 8 - 10 miles every two weeks to circulate the fluids and and to fully heat up the engine oil to 190 F + to drive out any moisture from the engine.

Thanks for the detailed info. My plan is to EMPTY the tank and then add 2.5 gallons of fuel. And that will hold me until this winter and start using fuel for ERDTT duties.

 

[jcanoe]

Thanks for the detailed info. My plan is to EMPTY the tank and then add 2.5 gallons of fuel. And that will hold me until this winter and start using fuel for ERDTT duties.

Just don't run the fuel tank completely dry. The Volt needs at least a small amount of fuel in the fuel tank else it will switch to reduced propulsion mode. Instead of emptying the tank now why not just get down to 1 gallon of old fuel and then add 1.5 gallons of fresh fuel. The mix would be 33% old fuel and 66% fresh fuel, that should keep FMM from running for 8 months. That should last you until sometime next winter when you stated you will add some fuel for Engine Assist Heat.

 

[wordptom]

Observation: I know the door label shows my car was built 06/16, but since the FMM chose today to run, can I assume my car was "built" or given birth on June 22nd 2016, 365 days ago? I say that because there must be a clock/calendar built into the car and someone had to write the code to make this work and it makes sense to say "365 days from TODAY start FMM on the day the car registered fuel being added". Thoughts/comments.

The FMM is triggered when the "average age" of the gas in the tank is ~12 months old, which suggests someone filled your Volt’s gas tank about June 22, 2016.

The FMM continues until something happens to change that average age of the gas in the Volt. Until then, you won’t be driving in Electric Mode, even with a full charge. If you drive until you run out of gas, you regain access to the battery, but go into Reduced Propulsion mode (reminding you that out of gas means engine is no longer available).

Whenever you run out of gas, after you put new gas into the tank, the engine will start and run a short self-test. If all is ok, everything returns to normal and you continue on in the driving mode you choose. I once used the Torque Pro app to monitor my gas volume when parked on a level surface, and refilled when it read 0%, 0.0 gallons remaining. There was no engine self-test performed in this case, indicating more fuel was remaining in the lines than if I had driven until the ICE stopped for lack of gas.

Even if you run out of gas, there’s still a wee bit of fuel in the lines. When I ran out of gas in my 2012 Volt to end my first FMM and filled the tank, my next FMM occurred 363 days later. Our friend Ari also chooses to run out before adding the minimum amount that will end the FMM (~1.5 gallons), and his FMMs usually occur ~313 days later (because the gas remaining in the lines after the tank is empty is enough to affect the overall "average age" of the ~1.5+ gallons now in the tank, lowering the next FMM date below the one year mark).

I’ve owned my 2012 Volt since April 2012, and drive 99% ev around home. I also tend to make a long vacation drive once a year or so (twice drove from Oregon to Michigan and back), so I try to time my last vacation fill-up to happen at least 100 miles from home. I reach home with plenty in the tank for any unexpected range extender needs, and I know it’s very possible I may make my next long trip before the next FMM window closes. After one of those fill-ups happened in late November, I discovered that if the most recent trip to the gas station was in mid to late winter one year, the desire to run the ICE and use up some of that getting-older gas for cabin heat the following cold season becomes very strong...

 

[BAZINGA]

The FMM is triggered when the "average age" of the gas in the tank is ~12 months old, which suggests someone filled your Volt’s gas tank about June 22, 2016.

The FMM continues until something happens to change that average age of the gas in the Volt. Until then, you won’t be driving in Electric Mode, even with a full charge. If you drive until you run out of gas, you regain access to the battery, but go into Reduced Propulsion mode (reminding you that out of gas means engine is no longer available).

Whenever you run out of gas, after you put new gas into the tank, the engine will start and run a short self-test. If all is ok, everything returns to normal and you continue on in the driving mode you choose. I once used the Torque Pro app to monitor my gas volume when parked on a level surface, and refilled when it read 0%, 0.0 gallons remaining. There was no engine self-test performed in this case, indicating more fuel was remaining in the lines than if I had driven until the ICE stopped for lack of gas.

Even if you run out of gas, there’s still a wee bit of fuel in the lines. When I ran out of gas in my 2012 Volt to end my first FMM and filled the tank, my next FMM occurred 363 days later. Our friend Ari also chooses to run out before adding the minimum amount that will end the FMM (~1.5 gallons), and his FMMs usually occur ~313 days later (because the gas remaining in the lines after the tank is empty is enough to affect the overall "average age" of the ~1.5+ gallons now in the tank, lowering the next FMM date below the one year mark).

I’ve owned my 2012 Volt since April 2012, and drive 99% ev around home. I also tend to make a long vacation drive once a year or so (twice drove from Oregon to Michigan and back), so I try to time my last vacation fill-up to happen at least 100 miles from home. I reach home with plenty in the tank for any unexpected range extender needs, and I know it’s very possible I may make my next long trip before the next FMM window closes. After one of those fill-ups happened in late November, I discovered that if the most recent trip to the gas station was in mid to late winter one year, the desire to run the ICE and use up some of that getting-older gas for cabin heat the following cold season becomes very strong...

More good info. Thanks. And I know the Volt isn't a BEV but we don't use it for long distance travel, and the Gen II's range is a lot more than I need for 99% of my DD duties. We need/use the BIGGER GMC Acadia for ANY road trips hence the limited of miles on my ICE. Unless something changes my ICE will be barley broken in when I trade it in a few years, probably for a BEV.

 

[TheBlueFlash]

Triggering FMM might be a sign a BEV is more appropriate for your driving habits. Why lug around 300 lbs. of dead engine weight and pay for synthetic oil changes every 2 years?

I'm not trying to troll, just genuinely curious, if you can go a full year without gas, why not just get a BEV and rent an ICE for those rare occasions you need it?

edit: Just reread your reply saying you own a Denali for road trips and that the Volt's range covers 99% of your daily trips. You could have gotten a used BEV a la Spark, Leaf, etc. and saved a ton of money instead of buying a new Volt.

edit2: eh sorry, this post sounds preachy. I don't mean it to. I'm just baffled.

 

[llninja]

Triggering FMM might be a sign a BEV is more appropriate for your driving habits. Why lug around 300 lbs. of dead engine weight and pay for synthetic oil changes every 2 years?

I'm not trying to troll, just genuinely curious, if you can go a full year without gas, why not just get a BEV and rent an ICE for those rare occasions you need it?

edit: Just reread your reply saying you own a Denali for road trips and that the Volt's range covers 99% of your daily trips. You could have gotten a used BEV a la Spark, Leaf, etc. and saved a ton of money instead of buying a new Volt.

edit2: eh sorry, this post sounds preachy. I don't mean it to. I'm just baffled.

Bazinga doesn't need to rent an icer. His signature shows that his other vehicle is a GMC Acadia. Plus he has GM pride - previous vehicles include a few vettes, two gen1 volts, and I think an Equinox (all in the same timeframe that I've owned one volt). He gets some special GM pricing that lets him trade in his cars for almost what he paid for them. So he plays vehicular musical chairs, pretty much for the fun of it

Plus in IL, they never sold the Spark EV. The bolt isn't quite here yet, but soon. But a non GM vehicle isn't in the cards, so no leaf, no focus electric, no i3. Though he's been eyeing a CPO Tesla model S for quite time time. I'm hoping Bazinga gets a CT6 Plug-in to keep the GM streak going.

 

[O'Dell]

You're lucky you only had five gallons. I had to burn through a full tank of the dealer's gas since I had never used any except for the EMM's. I only put in three gallons of non-ethanol, so it'll go faster the next time.

 

[BAZINGA]

LLninja, thanks for the summary, you pretty much outlined my lifestyle. And for The Blue Flash, I actually thought the Gen II Volt could work as our retirement road vehicle until we had two grandchildren pop into our lives. We tried living with a 5 seater (Volt and then Equinox) but after one trip to visit them we soon discovered we needed a BIGGER vehicle. 25% off MSRP on the new 6 pax GMC Acadia Denali with ACC sealed the deal. So our Volt has become my DD getting me to/from work (22 miles r/t) taking me to retirement soon and with a Level II EVSE in the garage I have even driven my Volt over 100 miles on a Saturday meeting 100% of my needs.

I have lusted over a Tesla MS (even own stock) but contrary to many fanboy pronouncements I'm still not comfortable going LONG distance even in a Tesla with their S/C network. I have family in three locations and two are at the limits of my comfort
/safety limits so a Volt is still my perferred long distance "EV".

In a nut shell, a GMC Acadia sized vehicle with a Voltec power train that could go about 40 miles electric would be the PERFECT vehicle for me and I suspect millions of Americans.

 

[TheBlueFlash]

Bazinga doesn't need to rent an icer. His signature shows that his other vehicle is a GMC Acadia. Plus he has GM pride - previous vehicles include a few vettes, two gen1 volts, and I think an Equinox (all in the same timeframe that I've owned one volt). He gets some special GM pricing that lets him trade in his cars for almost what he paid for them. So he plays vehicular musical chairs, pretty much for the fun of it

Plus in IL, they never sold the Spark EV. The bolt isn't quite here yet, but soon. But a non GM vehicle isn't in the cards, so no leaf, no focus electric, no i3. Though he's been eyeing a CPO Tesla model S for quite time time. I'm hoping Bazinga gets a CT6 Plug-in to keep the GM streak going.

Thanks, GM Loyaltist. Got it. Explains everything.

 

[llninja]

LLninja, thanks for the summary, you pretty much outlined my lifestyle. And for The Blue Flash, I actually thought the Gen II Volt could work as our retirement road vehicle until we had two grandchildren pop into our lives. We tried living with a 5 seater (Volt and then Equinox) but after one trip to visit them we soon discovered we needed a BIGGER vehicle. 25% off MSRP on the new 6 pax GMC Acadia Denali with ACC sealed the deal. So our Volt has become my DD getting me to/from work (22 miles r/t) taking me to retirement soon and with a Level II EVSE in the garage I have even driven my Volt over 100 miles on a Saturday meeting 100% of my needs.

I have lusted over a Tesla MS (even own stock) but contrary to many fanboy pronouncements I'm still not comfortable going LONG distance even in a Tesla with their S/C network. I have family in three locations and two are at the limits of my comfort
/safety limits so a Volt is still my perferred long distance "EV".

In a nut shell, a GMC Acadia sized vehicle with a Voltec power train that could go about 40 miles electric would be the PERFECT vehicle for me and I suspect millions of Americans.

Oh great, here I was starting to plan on becoming an empty nester, looking at 2 sweaters for myself, also looking at a Silverado quad cab instead of suburbans, and then you had to bring up grandchildren. I guess they are inevitable, so I should probably smash the Silverado plans and go back to a suburban, or at a minimum, think Acadia, traverse, volvo VC90. Dang, I was looking forward to that pickup bed.

 

[Toolworker]

Triggering FMM might be a sign a BEV is more appropriate for your driving habits. Why lug around 300 lbs. of dead engine weight and pay for synthetic oil changes every 2 years?

Range anxiety. I just don't want to think about it, and there is still no 200 mile BEV that I would want to drive (the Bolt's just not for me).

You're lucky you only had five gallons. I had to burn through a full tank of the dealer's gas since I had never used any except for the EMM's. I only put in three gallons of non-ethanol, so it'll go faster the next time.

The salesman asked if I wanted $20 instead of a full tank of gas, but I was so frazzled by the long sales process that I didn't take him up on it. Wish I had - I'd still be extending my Miles Driven Without Gas streak on VoltStats.

I burned off most of the tank and put in a couple of gallons.

Next time it gets to FMM, will it give me the opportunity to decline and run for a gas station? Or do I have to anticipate it?

 

[jcanoe]

You can decline once, the next time you start the Volt the FMM will run until either the fuel in the tank is used up or until you add sufficient gas to the tank to extend the average age of the fuel for a while. Adding a small amount of gas to the tank will not delay or extend the FMM program from running, it has to be significant amount to affect the total volume of fuel in the tank

 

[alfon]

With a 2016-17 Volt its probably would be good to run the gasoline engine in Hold mode until it gets close to empty than fill her up. Should be good for the engine as well. MPG's just on gas as been well over 45 + mpg, 53 mpg on our last trip with 186 miles on just gas. The 2016-17 is very fuel efficient on gas and EPA ratings place it ahead of the Corolla, Civic, Elantra, Kia Forte, etc.

With our 2016 Volt Premier we have to make a few long distance trips to Portland Or and surrounding ares well out of our current 60 mile electric summer range, we still have an overall average of 150 mpg, with well over 18,000 miles on the odometer...

 

[Toolworker]

With a 2016-17 Volt its probably would be good to run the gasoline engine in Hold mode until it gets close to empty than fill her up. Should be good for the engine as well.

I'm playing the VoltStats game and my MPG is over 1000. The engine can make do with EMM. I never turn it on except when the car forces it.

I've got 3 gallons now. I'll probably add another three when FMM comes up, extend my Miles Per Tank and Miles Without Gas some more, and then burn almost all of it off and start over.

It's tough racking up good stats when only driving 6000 miles a year though.

 

[wordptom]

Next time it gets to FMM, will it give me the opportunity to decline and run for a gas station? Or do I have to anticipate it?

Once the FMM message appears, you can postpone it until the next day, but each time you stop and restart the Volt the current day, the message will reappear, giving you the option again of postponing until the following day.

Once you say yes (or the next day), FMM will begin. The Gen 2 engine will not start until after a short delay once shifted into D (Drive), and will automatically continue at each vehicle start until fresh fuel is added. This differs from the Gen 1, which immediately starts the engine when you respond Yes. This applies to both EMM and FMM.

Note that you can’t Stop an FMM until you Start it, so don’t just postpone it, then drive to the gas station and add a couple of gallons, thinking to avoid it altogether. I suppose you could keep your "miles without gas" streak going by having a 1.5-gallon can of gas on hand or being next to the gas pump when you say Yes and shift into D long enough to get the engine to start, and then turning the car off and refueling, so you're not actually moving at any time during the FMM.

A posting some time ago indicated that one Volt owner postponed the FMM, then added 4 gallons to an existing 4 gallons. The following day the FMM message reappeared, and now he had 8 gallons of gas at the start of the FMM. Perhaps the computer sets a flag when it’s time for an FMM and doesn’t rerun an "average age of fuel" calculation until the next time gas is added after FMM has started. Perhaps if this owner had been able to add the ~1.5 gallon minimum amount to the tank after the FMM had started, the "average age of fuel" calculation would have been rerun to include the 4 gallons put in the previous day, and the next FMM would have been set for 6+ months down the road.

 

[wordptom]

Triggering FMM might be a sign a BEV is more appropriate for your driving habits. Why lug around 300 lbs. of dead engine weight and pay for synthetic oil changes every 2 years?

I'm not trying to troll, just genuinely curious, if you can go a full year without gas, why not just get a BEV and rent an ICE for those rare occasions you need it?

I’ve experienced two FMMs in the 5+ years I’ve driven my 2012 Volt. If my 40+ miles/charge meets my around-town needs 99% of the time, the 238+ mile range of the Bolt is overkill.

If the choice is between carrying around 200 rarely-used ev miles in a battery, or a gas engine that can get me 300 miles at the cost of an oil change every two years, the range extender is the more prudent choice for me. Others may have different preferences arising from different driving habits.

When I do head out, it’s for hours of driving. I submit that when driving for hours on the interstate, most of the passengers don’t really care if it’s an electric motor or gas engine that’s moving the car down the road. Many want to drive straight through to grandma’s house without making a half hour refueling stop somewhere before getting there and then again on the way home.

With my Volt, I can drive an electric car from home to the interstate, and from the interstate to the destination. Furthermore, with my Gen 1 Volt, even if I arrive at my destination with a fully depleted battery, I’m still driving an electric car through those stop-and-go urban streets, and the 25-35 mph residential streets and 20 mph school zones, in a single-motor EV fueled by gas-generated electricity. GM refers to the Extended Range driving in the Gen 1 Volt as an "electric-like" experience. It’s hard to see, but for the use of gas to create the electricity, where driving a Gen 1 Volt in single-motor Extended Range mode differs from driving a BEV.