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I was surprised today to see an announcement today of a new plug-in hybrid mini van from Chrysler.

You can read about some of the details here: http://www.topspeed.com/cars/chrysler/2017-chrysler-pacifica-hybrid-ar172211.html#main

It looks like Chrysler took a page straight out of the Volt playbook, with a 16KWH battery,giving the Van a 30 mile range on batteries alone. I will be curious to see how similar the drive train is to that of the Volt.

Given that I have need of an 8 passenger mini-van, one of these may be in my future. I just wish GM had put the Volt drive train into something similar.
 

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You and a lot more other people, myself included. I really hope Chrysler adds AWD to this van as an option. I do believe many people will want this type of vehicle. I have said many times that I want to replace my wife's Saturn Outlook with an AWD vehicle like the Volt that will seat 7-8 people. Chrysler nailed it! Just add AWD for me Chrysler and you have a sale. I noticed the RAV4 Hybrid did a pretty neat set up for AWD as it is not coupled to the motor in any way. Interesting....

Why isn't GM building something like this?!?
 

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There's already a thread or two here about it. It debuted on Tuesday I believe.
 

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You and a lot more other people, myself included. I really hope Chrysler adds AWD to this van as an option. I do believe many people will want this type of vehicle. I have said many times that I want to replace my wife's Saturn Outlook with an AWD vehicle like the Volt that will seat 7-8 people. Chrysler nailed it! Just add AWD for me Chrysler and you have a sale. I noticed the RAV4 Hybrid did a pretty neat set up for AWD as it is not coupled to the motor in any way. Interesting....

Why isn't GM building something like this?!?
For most drivers, AWD is over kill. Costs more to build, buy and service. Not to mention the MPG/EV Range hit.

Put most buyers behind the wheel of the same car in AWD & FWD configurations, most could not even tell.

Driving enthusiasts are another story, but most vehicles are sold to BUYERS, not ENTHUSIASTS.
 

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For most drivers, AWD is over kill. Costs more to build, buy and service. Not to mention the MPG/EV Range hit.

Put most buyers behind the wheel of the same car in AWD & FWD configurations, most could not even tell.

Driving enthusiasts are another story, but most vehicles are sold to BUYERS, not ENTHUSIASTS.
You are right. Subaru shouldn't even exist as a car company, nor anything else that is AWD or 4WD or has traction control or stability control or airbags, side nor rear, nor knee, or collision avoidance or ABS or....should eliminate cruise control too and bring back the cigarette lighter.

It's about choices. Choices. I have a real need and desire for AWD. The difference between an AWD vehicle and a FWD vehicle is stunning in certain situations when extra traction is needed.
 

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You are right. Subaru shouldn't even exist as a car company, nor anything else that is AWD or 4WD or has traction control or stability control or airbags, side nor rear, nor knee, or collision avoidance or ABS or....should eliminate cruise control too and bring back the cigarette lighter.

It's about choices. Choices. I have a real need and desire for AWD. The difference between an AWD vehicle and a FWD vehicle is stunning in certain situations when extra traction is needed.
Don't put words in my mouth and you are being silly ;)

Subaru did it to cut costs. Sharing platforms and offering less configurations saves an automaker a LOT of money. Nobody has an issue with AWD being offered, but the myth is that is is required or SO much better than AWD for most car buyers. It isn't.

AWD drives up the cost of the vehicle and impacts MPG/Range. Not everything needs an AWD version available is what I'm saying.
 

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Don't put words in my mouth and you are being silly ;)

Subaru did it to cut costs. Sharing platforms and offering less configurations saves an automaker a LOT of money. Nobody has an issue with AWD being offered, but the myth is that is is required or SO much better than AWD for most car buyers. It isn't.

AWD drives up the cost of the vehicle and impacts MPG/Range. Not everything needs an AWD version available is what I'm saying.
Of course I was being overly-dramatic, but I wanted to make the point of having choices. I have had both AWD vehicles and FWD vehicles. AWD is a box my family wants to check and so do many other people. To dismiss AWD as unnecessary depends on the situation a person is in or might get into. I prefer to have one vehicle that has it for MANY reasons. Toyota did a very neat system by adding AWD to their recent Toyota Rav4 Hybrid AWD. The security for AWD is amazing for going, and starting, when extra traction is needed. Stopping, nada, steering, usually nada, but going, it's great and extremely useful. Ever needed to dart out in the rain while turning your front steering wheel? In most cars, that one wheel will spin away and you will slowly get going. With an AWD vehicle, you will "GO" with no slipping whatsoever. My Subaru Forester was amazing with snow tires and very impressive with regular all season tires. I wish my Volt had AWD too :)
 

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You and a lot more other people, myself included. I really hope Chrysler adds AWD to this van as an option. I do believe many people will want this type of vehicle. I have said many times that I want to replace my wife's Saturn Outlook with an AWD vehicle like the Volt that will seat 7-8 people. Chrysler nailed it! Just add AWD for me Chrysler and you have a sale. I noticed the RAV4 Hybrid did a pretty neat set up for AWD as it is not coupled to the motor in any way. Interesting....

Why isn't GM building something like this?!?
Because:
- they'd cannibalize high-margin CUV and SUV sales OR
- AWD electric would add more cost and sales would suffer OR
- they'll only do it when it can work for larger vehicle
 

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First post since I joined the forum, what I find amazing is that they get a 30 mile range out of a vehicle that is heavier and larger than a Volt, with a battery pack that is the same size as the original volt that had a rating of only 35 miles. Way to go Chrysler.
 

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On dry pavement it can be hard to tell. Cover the road in snow and it's a no-brainer. There's a reason Subaru has had the best-selling models in Colorado, Oregon, Vermont, Maine, etc...
 

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This is the set up in the Rav4 hybrid.

"Hybrid RAV4s will come only with all-wheel drive, so there’s a 150-hp, 2.5-liter, Atkinson-cycle four-cylinder up front, coupled to a 141-hp, permanent-magnet electric motor using the traditional Toyota CVT automatic. This combination powers the front wheels. The rear wheels are powered by a 67-hp electric motor that has no mechanical connection to the front wheels. This system is called AWD-i, and it allows a great degree of flexibility in the front-to-rear power split. As in most such systems, the RAV4 drives its front wheels most of the time, but Toyota says that the system looks at the driver demands and the steering-wheel position to anticipate wheelspin and engage the rear wheels before the fronts even start to slip.

The hybrid all-wheel-drive system also allows greater regenerative braking because it can capture electrical energy through all four wheels rather than just the two driven ones as in most hybrids.
"

The price increment for the hybrid powertrain is only $700. per Car and Driver
 

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First post since I joined the forum, what I find amazing is that they get a 30 mile range out of a vehicle that is heavier and larger than a Volt, with a battery pack that is the same size as the original volt that had a rating of only 35 miles. Way to go Chrysler.
Part of the untold details there, is that the Volt used 10.4kWh of the 16kWh battery. This very conservative use is what helps the batteries to hold up so well in a Volt over time. I suspect Chrysler is using something more like 14kWh to get the range they are advertising. I'm sure we'll know soon enough.
 

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It's about choices. Choices. I have a real need and desire for AWD. The difference between an AWD vehicle and a FWD vehicle is stunning in certain situations when extra traction is needed.
You're free to make any choice you want. No one should question your desire for AWD and he's not. He's questioning the need for it. In this regard, I think the preponderance of the science says that AWD is entirely unnecessary outside a few very specific situations: http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a3091/the-myth-of-the-all-powerful-all-wheel-drive-15202862/ Having lived in Alaska where Subaru is the state car, I can attest that studded snow tires on a FWD vehicle with traction control is all anyone "needs".

We are talking about a mini-van ... .
 

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You're free to make any choice you want. No one should question your desire for AWD and he's not. He's questioning the need for it. In this regard, I think the preponderance of the science says that AWD is entirely unnecessary outside a few very specific situations: http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a3091/the-myth-of-the-all-powerful-all-wheel-drive-15202862/ Having lived in Alaska where Subaru is the state car, I can attest that studded snow tires on a FWD vehicle with traction control is all anyone "needs".

We are talking about a mini-van ... .
I read the article (again). It completely agreed with what I said in another post. Traction as in "go" AWD is superb. Stopping, nada, steering, usually nada, but traction is as different as night and day. I believe I understand my needs very well. And the few times a year I truly need AWD, it is a life saver. In the few instances I need to dart out in traffic or get out of someone's way (especially in the rain), it is priceless. AWD has tremendous advantages over a FWD car.

Per the article, "Even so, we're talking about minor improvements. If you're looking for the peace of mind in knowing that you'll be able to get home if an unexpected snowstorm hits, AWD may be a good choice for you." "AWD is great at aiding accelerating on slick surfaces and keeping a vehicle moving on snowy roads."

Bottom line is this, had you rather have an AWD car with snow tires or a FWD car with snow tires.

OR, a FWD car with all season tires, or a an AWD car with all season tires.

This is not an either or situation. It is about which is the best. Clearly anyone concerned about traction is going to check the box with AWD in both situations. It is not an either AWD or snow tires. A person can use both, and I have. Also, if I haven't put snow tires on, and it gets bad, I can still drive home with that extra traction.

In both instances, I am going to check the box for AWD, and so will many other people if given the choice. Does everybody need to do so? Of course not, but I understand my needs and wants. I don't live where the roads are always plowed or it is flatter than a pancake. I also like to be the most prepared I can
 

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For most drivers, AWD is over kill. Costs more to build, buy and service. Not to mention the MPG/EV Range hit.

Put most buyers behind the wheel of the same car in AWD & FWD configurations, most could not even tell.

Driving enthusiasts are another story, but most vehicles are sold to BUYERS, not ENTHUSIASTS.
true Joe, but most buyers buy for emotional reasons, cup holder counts and other "features" that will seldom if ever be used. the meaningless 5th seat belt in dozens of compact car models is an example of this. ya gotta build what people want to buy. ...

oh yea, please chevy, give us the V-eequinox- a voltec powered Equinox with the option of adding small rear wheel in wheel motors...
 

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I do like the look, both inside and out, of this new Pacifica. And the plug-in version with 30 miles all-electric range sounds pretty intriguing. But FCA has so many quality issues. I personally would stay away. And now there's a new allegation against FCA. They have been accused, by two FCA dealerships, of paying dealers to falsify sales numbers. The result has allegedly been overstated sales data in the pursuit of higher stock prices. FCA has denied this latest allegation.

http://www.thecarconnection.com/new...t-says-fca-responds?google_editors_picks=true
 

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the only way they can get that many miles out of the same sized 16 KW battery is by functionally using much more of it. The Gen 1volt only used about 10KW which is only ~ 65% of the 16 KW. It' s electric mileage was about 3.7 miles per KW
I suspect the much heavier, less aerodynamic Pacifica will likely be rated at about 2.2 miles per KW hour
That means it will likely use 13.5 kw of the 16, or 85% of the battery.
No magical efficiency developments.
Volt Gen 1 was very conservative (that's why 4 year old batteries are like new)
I suspect Chevy bolt will use 85%, maybe even 90% SOC with more durable chemistries, and the Gen 1 as validation.
 

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Given that I have need of an 8 passenger mini-van, one of these may be in my future. I just wish GM had put the Volt drive train into something similar.
I hope it won't sour you on this minivan, but it looks like the hybrid model will not be 8 passenger. To quote the chrysler website "The Chrysler Pacifica has expanded seating to accommodate up to eight passengers on non-hybrid models. " No stow & go on the second row either. Probably 7 seater to leave an aisle to reach the 3rd row.
 

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Also, good luck finding one of these in a non-CARB state anytime soon. It looks nice and all (if you can get over the fact it's a minivan), but this is a total compliance play by FCA at the moment. They haven't committed to a national release. Probably only people in Cali will be able to get one this year.
 
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