GM has been using chain drives in similar applications at least since the late '60s in the Toronado and FWD Cadillacs, both of which had a lot more torque than the Volt. It's a long proven technology.

 

2016 Volt Transmission Observations

FWIW: Better pics and explanation at the link above...

 

Would you be equally concerned about a belt drive in the transmissions of CVT equipped Asian vehicles?

 

Not worried in the least.... GM has been using them since the advent of fwd. GM has lots of experience with them. The power of the Volt will be no problem for it to handle.

 

Yes SIr, pretty much all GM's front wheel drive transaxles use chain, have not researched other brands.
And usually the chain is not the point of failure when things go bad in the transmission- it is the torque converter, clutches or valves, electronics.

 

What does the Gen 1 use if not chains?

 

Gears.

 

These are silent chains and they are amazing. With superior metallurgy and running bathed in oil, they will last "forever".

 

Reassuring to anyone who's had to change a camshaft timing chain on a '66 Impala.

 

the shop that fixed my nephew's truck said they see it all the time. if you have a hi/low 4wd selection on your truck you should have several settings, off, auto, hi, low. don't leave it in auto. set to off and it disengages the transfer case like on an old truck. obviously just use the auto function when you have conditions that merit in and out of the 4wd. the output shaft bearings on those are another weak point.

the folks that bought the all wheel drive in the denali and escalade have most of the problems.

edit to add, with 8,000 on a 1998 i wouldn't get to concerned if you aren't using if for rock crawling all the time.... my 2010 suburban has 23,600 on it and it is always set to off....... i'm not concerned about it at all.

 

Good advice. I've been leaving it in auto thinking it wasn't engaging except in snow. Correction though, it's a 2008.

 

opps, my mistake 2008. lmao..... i've been friends with the service manger at my dealer for roughly 30 years and we had owned the suburban for about 2, we had always left it in auto. i was curious about it and asked him (he has a 2010 avalanche) he said not to drive it all the time in auto. obviously part of the transfer case is still working to drive the read but it's much less stress.

another correction, i don't remember exactly, i don't think is says off, i think it says 2wd, 4-hi, 4-low and auto. shows you how much we drive it...... lmao

 

another correction, i don't remember exactly, i don't think is says off, i think it says 2wd, 4-hi, 4-low and auto. shows you how much we drive it...... lmao

Sounds more like what I recall (sitting at my desk).

Anybody that don't believe that needs to drive a 1976 eldorado and see how much it jerks back and forth from the slack when you let off the gas and give it gas again.....

Dang, I really wanted one of those old boats, just 'cuz.

 

FWIW, the Prius uses a very similar chain drive design. How often do we hear about Prius transmission problems? Not often, and usually the problem is with on of the MG units, not the final drive itself.

In extremely general terms, chain drive is lighter, quieter (when lubricated), more flexible in terms of design / manufacturing, and cheaper to produce. Gear drive is stronger, longer lasting, but heavier and more costly to produce. Volt II probably switched to chain drive for weight and cost reasons.

 

Gen III Prius went to a gear drive.

 

Gears fail, chains fail, and belts fail...

Gears or a chain over a belt please. Notice that the change interval for a timing belt is sooner than for a timing chain. BOTH eventually need to get changed.

I wouldn't compare an on road only, lightweight (comparably), non-tow rated, FWD car to a 4WD truck that is going off road or being operated in 4WD.

 

Gears fail, chains fail, and belts fail...

Gears or a chain over a belt please. Notice that the change interval for a timing belt is sooner than for a timing chain. BOTH eventually need to get changed.

I wouldn't compare an on road only, lightweight (comparably), non-tow rated, FWD car to a 4WD truck that is going off road or being operated in 4WD.

Is that the truth...Toyotas of the 80s were infamous for having timing belts fail...RECOMMENDED replacement no more than 50,000 miles...


http://archive.constantcontact.com/fs119/1111134277991/archive/1113278987022.html

 

All my FWD GM vehicles use chain drives in their transmissions. My 1984 Olds Ciera lasted with me 26 years with only the torque converter failure after 22 years of use. The chain drive never failed. My present 21 year old Buick Regal (in my signature) still has the original 3.8 L V6 engine and the 4T60-E transmission with no failures or repairs. Obviously the schedule preventive maintenance must be followed.

GM invented and makes the world's best automatic transmissions. Even Rolls-Royce used them and presently has a license from GM to copy them. Most failures are cause by abusive drivers, not by normal use, as I have proven with my two older GM vehicles. My newer 2009 Equinox has an automatic transmission made by Aisin in Japan (a Toyota company), so if Toyota and other Japanese companies use and trust them, my Equinox should last many more miles and years.

The new 5ET50 EDU for the 2016 Volt is a great technological achievement, since it integrates two electric motors, two clutches (one is for the ICE), planetary gears, output differential, and controller in a small compact package, such that it will be replacing almost all the automatic transmissions in future GM vehicles, and the first example is the 2016 Chevy Malibu Hybrid. I expect to see it used in other 2017 models (except the Bolt EV which has its own advanced design), and upgraded for the trucks and large SUVs. The 2016 Cadillac CT6 PHEV will have the first RWD version of the Voltec drive unit.

 

My present 21 year old Buick Regal (in my signature) still has the original 3.8 L V6 engine and the 4T60-E transmission with no failures or repairs. .

Indeed, the 3.8L V6 and 4T60 were bullet proof, GM nailed that combo. few small issues come to mind... ignition coils and some camshaft bearings walked out causing low oil pressure... I had a supercharged grandprix GTP with that setup, sold it at 120K miles, not a single issue... I loved that car. Heads up display, full comfort seat and fast enough... oh yes the good old days.

GM's 5.7L and 4L60 (suburbans) or 4L80 were also great combos.

It's interesting that Prius went from chain (Gen. 2) to gear (Gen. 3) while Volt went from gear (Gen. 1) to chain (Gen. 2). Personally, I'll take gear over chain any day!

Chain = Weight reduction and allows for better fitment in tight areas, you can route a chain around funky curves within the case - with rollers or guides - slim down the case size and shape. For front wheel drive cars often it is a necessity.
If you have a farm tractor with all the room you need and can benefit form the additional weight - then go with gears.

 

It's interesting that Prius went from chain (Gen. 2) to gear (Gen. 3) while Volt went from gear (Gen. 1) to chain (Gen. 2). Personally, I'll take gear over chain any day!

 

Toyota went from chain to gear drive to make their trans more compact. Go figure.

 

Well, the 440-T4 had its problems. I used to have a '90 Regal (and still have a '90 Reatta) with the 440-T4. The Regal lost a thrust washer at about 75K miles. The 1->2 shift in particular was always 'interesting' in that car. But I continued to drive it for another 200K miles or so and the tranny kept on going until I sold the car. By the time GM upgraded the 440-T4 to the 4T60E, they seem to have found and fixed most of the weak points.

 

How do you feel about it?

View attachment 81650 View attachment 81658

Fine. Manufacturers have been using chains for probably longer than you've been alive in drive units.

 

Gear. Chain. They're both metal on metal. I don't see a difference at least conceptually.

Mike

 

Actually, now that this thread has awakened, I'll contradict my statement above and say I do see one difference. With gears, you have 2 or maybe 3 gear teeth bearing all the load. With a chain, the torque is distributed to roughly half the teeth on the gear. At least conceptually, I would think a chain would be better for that reason.

Mike

 

Chains are reliable, efficient and quiet. Not an issue!

 

The Volt chain in action.

 

Similar chains are often used in motorcycle alternator drives....where the alternator is placed BEHIND the engine, to minimize width ( usually runs on one end of the crank)...I've had motorcycle Hy Vo Chains......like that, go for 180,000 miles...here's quite a LOT of torque ( relatively speaking) in a high powered motorcycle engine!!

 

Chains break all the time in regular service. Had one break on my Triumph motorcycle. You hear of them breaking all the time in a timing chain situation. My Dad had one break on his Ford. And that's a chain that doesn't have a lot of tension on it (especially compared to a drive chain). Never heard of a gear breaking unless it has been abused. Gears do wear eventually, especially if they are fiber gears used for noise abaitment reasons. I'll take a gear over a chain any day.

 

Guess I've been lucky then. Going back over 40 years, I have had a long list of cars with timing chains, and have not had a single one break. I don't recall a timing chain breaking on any of my parent's cars either.

My last car with one was our 2006 Mazda 3 which we sold to a friend after we bought our Volt last year. The 3 has over 150,000 mi. on it now. And my 2011 Cruze has a chain too.

A chain is certainly much preferable to a belt anyway. One of those broke on me once because I didn't replace it in time. Fortunately it was a non interference engine, and it happened in my garage.

I know they do break from time to time, but I'm not worried about the chain breaking on our Volt. Not the drive chain, or the timing chain.



Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

Single row chain, like a cam chain....maybe, you're supposed to replace those at <50K miles??

Hy Vo Chain like the one pictured.......I've opened up a motorcycle engine.....mine, with 240,000 miles on it, to find the hy vo chain was stretched but serviceable....but the rubber/metal chain guide had destroyed itself!!!

 

I think the AWD in my 2001 330xi uses a chain. What alternative do you have?

 

BorgWarner supplies its Hy-Vo chain to GM for Chevy Volt and Chevy Malibu Hybrid vehicles. https://auto.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/auto-technology/borgwarner-supplies-hy-vo-chains-to-chevrolet-volt-plug-in-hybrid-malibu-hybrid/57314424

From a Wikipedia article on the 1966 Oldsmobile Toronado (the '66 Toronado was the first front wheel drive vehicle produced in the US since the 1937 Cord.)

"The Turbo-Hydramatic heavy-duty three-speed automatic transmission became available during development of the Toronado. Called the TH425 in FWD form, the transmission's torque converter was separated from its planetary gearset, with the torque converter driving the gearset through a 2 in (51 mm) wide silent chain-drive called Hy-Vo, riding on two 7.5 in (19 cm) sprockets. The Hy-Vo chain drive was developed by GM's Hydra-Matic Division and Morse Chain Division of Borg-Warner. The chains were made from very strong hardened steel and required no tensioners or idler pulleys because they were pre-stretched on a special machine at the factory."

 

It was the 1966 Toronado, I owned one.