Clarification: Chevy Volt Mule Production Timeline NOT Delayed, only Journalist Test Drive is
Bob Lutz reiterated on Monday during the Cadillac press conference, that he was overly optimistic about having mules for test drives in Easter, and once again said it would be “more like June”.
I was able to get some clarification on this from Tony Posawatz, the Volt’s chief engineer, just after Lutz’ comment.
Tony said “Bob is an accountable guy, he always speaks the truth.”… “He wanted to have an event when journalists could drive early Volt properties, to get to see how the system worked, how close we were to 40 miles range, etc, etc.”..”we have counseled him that for safety reasons, and to give the engineers a little more time to drive them themselves, it might be better to do it in June”.
Very importantly Tony said “There has been no change (in timing) to our development activities.” Specifically they are still on the same timeline for the mules, it’s just that they want the mules to be more advanced than they will be in April before they let outside journalists drive them.
Tony said with respect to packs being late, “well a week or two here or there, that’s nothing too significant”..”the timetable is very compressed, it’s hard”..”if it were something more substantiative as it relates to the program, we’d let you know”..”A123’s pack will be here by the end of the month”..”We have put demands on these suppliers that are kind of unheard of, and we’d prefer it that way”..”we are asking people to stretch beyond their normal limits given the nature of the technology.”
I asked him about the issue of the software needing to be more perfected before test drives. He said “exactly, thats the issue”…”We wanted to make sure that safety proceeds, that we’ve got everything covered. We want to have a little bit more time so that the driving experience of the journalists is a little less crude. It will still be somewhat crude. We talked to Bob about it. He understood he got a little ahead of himself. You got to give him credit, he is always going to be honest. He wanted to make sure because he said it that he would say it in front of everyone at (at the press conference).”
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52 Responses to “Clarification: Chevy Volt Mule Production Timeline NOT Delayed, only Journalist Test Drive is”
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January 16th, 2008 at 8:05 am
Great news Lyle. Expect you’ll have a test drive in June. Looking forward to the report.
January 16th, 2008 at 8:13 am
I also read somewhere that Bob made the quip about having the mules on the road by Easter without realizing how early Easter came this year.
Whatever the case, the huge, huge amount of attention that he Volt is getting must surely be total validation and vindication of the whole idea of the extended range electric vehicle.
I must admit that I originally thought “plug-in hybrid” was a simpler term for something like the Volt, but really, Bob Lutz was totally right to insist on the term “extended range electric vehicle.” Especially now that we see how Toyota is trying to compare a slightly modified plug-in Prius to GM’s Volt project. In truth, the Volt is miles ahead — literally — of this approach (about 30 all-electric miles ahead).
January 16th, 2008 at 8:35 am
Lyle:
Thanks for the reports and updates like this.
After reading this, I am feeling a little better on the “delay” issue. I hope this clarification gets through to the people that are immediately ready to call the Volt “vaporware”. Set-backs can and should be expected—that’s life, and it doesn’t mean that the whole vehicle is a sham, etc. I’m personally accepting of some set-backs, if it means that the end product is proven and reliable. Let them do their homework and work out the bugs ahead of time, so that we don’t have to.
Best regards!
January 16th, 2008 at 8:52 am
Yea, I agree that the explanation makes some sense. A123 has around 2 weeks to give their product to them, the next milestone.
Not the worst pun I’ve ever committed.
Fingers crossed…
January 16th, 2008 at 10:37 am
‘GM has only three versions of the experimental lithium-ion battery packs it intends to use in its E-flex electric vehicles, said Lutz. “The fourth one will be delivered this week.” After bench testing, they will be installed in test vehicles.” Published Jan 14, 08.
So what the first three? The A123 round cell version from Cobasy for the Vue, and the two versions from LG for the Volt? Does this mean that the A123/Conti will ship not “in early 2008,” not by the “end of the month (January 2008) but by January 19, 2008? Time will tell.
January 16th, 2008 at 11:18 am
The problem here is that you have the top-tier guys, that will give the sound bytes, and then you have the engineers that are building this stuff.
The sound bytes will get over analyzed to death, but really mean nothing.
I would always rather get the real info from the hardware and software engineers and techs that are actually working on this project!
And nice mule picture, by the way!!!!
January 16th, 2008 at 11:20 am
Lyle …thanks for the clarification. I am sure there will be several more hiccups along the way. We should all be prepared for these events and not fall off the deep end.
January 16th, 2008 at 11:22 am
attention that he Volt is getting must surely be total validation and vindication of the whole idea of the extended range electric vehicle.
Which is really quite old idea, so i still dont get whats all the hoopla about.
Nice mule on the pic, indeed.
January 16th, 2008 at 11:32 am
Yeah, nice picture. Nice bump in the wait list too. Any bets on when it tops 10,000? At this rate what will it be by the end of 2010? 40,000? More? Is the rate of increase accelerating? Maybe you will have the whole first years’s production spoken for before the first one gets delivered!
Mr. Wagoner was quoted in the papers about the unprecedented buzz around the Volt. I think that you guys have quite a bit to do with it. All in all, the tone here is a lot more positive than what I have been seeing in the press reports from the Detroit Auto Show. I hope that he and Mr. Lutz realize that.
January 16th, 2008 at 11:41 am
10,000 on the wait list is nothing to sneeze at, even if only 10% of those turn out to be actual buyers. It’d blow the Tesla wait list to shreds. Hellooo GM, doesn’t it mean something to you?
January 16th, 2008 at 11:57 am
That bump in the wait list happened today.
This morning at 6:30 it was under 9000. Very cool that it went up that quickly in half a day.
January 16th, 2008 at 12:03 pm
Dave B., #10:
If they would give us a way to make a deposit, maybe thay could get a better handle on how many on the wait list are for real.
Smart got a pretty good buzz out of their on-line $99 deposit initiative. I would put up more than that, but maybe that would be a good place to start.
I think that it would give the Volt more credibility, and maybe be a morale booster for the development team - not to mention the stockholders and dealers.
Put up $99 and get a t-shirt?
January 16th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
I love your picture of the Volt Mule. I wonder where they’ll put the batteries? Is the styling of the production car going in a similar direction? What’s the C.D. of a Mule?
January 16th, 2008 at 12:36 pm
To Noel Park:
You may very well have something there with the Deposit initiative idea. Money certainly speaks louder than most everything else, and gives GM a solid indication of serious customers. Hope they are listening.
January 16th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
Great news/clarification! Looks like Watanabe won’t miss his appointment for an egg face mask and pedicure at the spa after all.
January 16th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
Noel Park 12
I wanted to do that as well, but was told that only the dealers could accept a down payment.
So, if 10,000 or even 5,000 people made deposits on the Volt, that would be quite a press event. Don’t you think?
January 16th, 2008 at 1:09 pm
[quote comment="27713"]To Noel Park:
You may very well have something there with the Deposit initiative idea. Money certainly speaks louder than most everything else, and gives GM a solid indication of serious customers. Hope they are listening.[/quote]
I think this is a GREAT idea!!! I’ll write the check NOW!
I’d even be willing to do it to get a test program Volt from Project Driveway. If they go that route with the Volt that is.
January 16th, 2008 at 1:13 pm
I’m in too, Noel.
GM should really wake up to this idea.
And I really would like a T-Shirt.
January 16th, 2008 at 1:54 pm
I’m with Rashiid; would really like a T-Shirt. It would be something to wear when I have coffee with 10-15 guys every morning. Several of them are Ford retirees who are always putting down GM vehicles. I would love to hear what they have to say about Ford’s E-REV plans!
January 16th, 2008 at 1:56 pm
why do i get a feeling that lots of folks on this site would be on the waiting list for hot air or bottled water, if it only had a GM badge on it?
January 16th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
Volvo just showed their ReCharge concept (range extended series hybrid), which is like the one they’ve shown before, but this one with a 1.6L diesal ICE driving the range extending generator.
See http://www.autospectator.com/cars/volvo/0036720-volvo-recharge-concept-plug-hybrid-battery-only-range-60-miles
60 miles/charge on the battery at up to 100mph highway, 4 hub mounted wheel motors for real all wheel drive, 3 hour recharge, etc
No hint if/when this would turn into a production vehicle, which markets, or pricing. Note that even if Volvo came out with it at the same time as the Volt, even at the same price (the Volvo is likely to be significantly more), that Volvo does not produce vehicles in any where near the volume of the others.
But also note that Volvo is owned by Ford (who actually killed Volvo’s EV program when they acquired them) so any technology you see come out in a Volvo could make it into a Ford.
January 16th, 2008 at 1:59 pm
Here’s an idea. Instead of all of us helter skelter making deposits, let’s pick a particular date, and then storm our local dealers with deposit checks!
I suggest the Saturday after the mule drives. That will provide a one-two punch. While all the attention is still on the Volt, we all rush in with $99. and create another wave. Doing this in mass would be just the ticket!
January 16th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
As a follow up to #19, I might even want to purchase a Chevy Volt T-shirt for all my Ford friends!
January 16th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
Good idea #22 George K — perhaps we could call the local media to witness us storming our local dealerships!
January 16th, 2008 at 2:09 pm
[quote comment="27733"]why do i get a feeling that lots of folks on this site would be on the waiting list for hot air or bottled water, if it only had a GM badge on it?[/quote]
Kert,
Unlike our idiots in Congress and other “elected officials,” some of us see the Volt as a way to solve serious social issues and are willing to put our money where our mouth is. Unlike others, who would rather just see the transfer of wealth from one group to another.
January 16th, 2008 at 2:12 pm
Before I write a cheque for a deposit, I want GM to say two things about the Volt that it hasn’t said so far:
1) That every Volt sold will meet California’s PZEV emissions standard. Other GM hybrids get better fuel economy than regular cars, but as far as I can tell they haven’t spent the extra money to lower their tailpipe emissions.
I want to know that every Volt - not just those in California emissions states - will be as clean as possible. I imagine that they are planning this for the Volt, but I want a commitment from someone high up that this will be the case.
2) That the Volt will meet the IIHS safety standards for a “Top Safety Pick.” Right now, GM only has one car that does - the Cadillac CTS - and one SUV. Again, given the engineering effort that’s going into the Volt, this would not be a difficult commitment to make, and it would go a long way to assuaging people’s concerns over the Volt’s safety. They could say, not only are our batteries safe, but you’re driving one of the safest cars on the road, period.
So far, GM has said the Volt will be based on the next-generation Cobalt architecture. Well, the current Cobalt gets “Good” ratings in front and rear tests, but only acceptable ratings in side test. It shouldn’t take too much to make the Volt better than that. And GM should resist the temptation to give us cool-looking seats that don’t have anti-whiplash active head restraint design.
January 16th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
#24 Estero
OK. I’m serious here. Please spread the word that it’s Saturday, the week of the mule drives!
Make a deposit at your Chevy dealer. That’s what I’ll be doing, hopefuly along with thousands of others.
So, if you really want the car, we might as well all do it together, and make a difference!
January 16th, 2008 at 3:05 pm
Dave B, #25:
Too bloody right!
If anyone watched the election coverage from Michigan, the phrase “one state recession” was repeated over and over again. My hope is the the Volt can help with that too.
January 16th, 2008 at 3:06 pm
BTW, for about the 100th time, thanks guys, you are awesome!
January 16th, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Lyle,
I have been following your site almost since you started it. I too work in the medical field and don’t see how you have enough time to do both, but keep it up it’s great. I have beent to other blogs but this is by far the most enthusiastic bunch of people I have seen. It’s good to see different reactions to each days blog. All I can say is keep up the good work and thanks for all the good info. Again nice touch with the mule.
January 16th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Not sure if you guys have seen this:
Bob Lutz, vice chairman of GM: Styling-wise, we’ve got it sorted out. We’ve done all the wind-tunnel optimization that’s resulted in the car looking a little different from the concept. The hood’s gotten shorter and the windshield’s got more slant. The drag coefficient’s where we want it.
WN: Where exactly is that?
Lutz: It’s in the mid-twos. When we put the concept in the wind tunnel, it was a disaster. We could almost put it in the wind tunnel backward and get a better result.
Mid-twos! The Prius is great and I believe it is .30, if memory serves!
http://www.wired.com/cars/futuretransport/news/2008/01/lutz_volt_qa
January 16th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
I just pinned a $100 bill to my calender, just say when and I’ll pin it to the appropriate day!!
January 16th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Great idea Guys, well done.
January 16th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
#31 ziv
The Prius cd is .26. Sounds like that is just about where the Volt is.
January 16th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
Sad to see yet more slippage, this time in the area of price. Only a little while ago the Volt was to be priced comfortably below #30,000, now the initial price has slipped to closer to $40,000. If the PHEV Prius costs less than $30,000, GM’s moon shot may be Apollo 13.
January 16th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Ziv, #31:
Thanks for the link. The article actually links you to a list of Cds for various cars. It also shows some examples the Cd times the frontal area, which is the real issue producing drag.
Mr. Lutz’s comment about price is a little scary. Oh well, in for a penny, in for a pound. We’ve got 3 years to save up!
January 16th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
Prius is at 0.26 Cd or something very similar. Sounds like the Volt is similarly slippery.
Pricewise, economies of scale should bring costs down below $30k. I think GM should sell the car below $30k anyway partly for PR purposes, so as to get the vehicle widely distributed and with a good reputation as a reliable efficient car. Write it off as an advertising cost.
Then add in the all-important halo effect.
Plus, without building demand up, you won’t get those economies of scale worked up anyway.
January 16th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
#32 Robert V.
Great idea! Lets save it for the Saturday of the mule drives! How about everyone push for that date!
Lyle, is there anything you can do? How about a topic on this forum the week before, reminding people of the coordinated date?
January 16th, 2008 at 4:58 pm
http://www.wired.com/cars/futuretransport/news/2008/01/lutz_volt_qa
40 G’s ? I hope that’s a mistake…
January 16th, 2008 at 6:06 pm
I like the idea of a push to give deposits, but unless GM has a policy in place to accept them, it will fall on deaf ears at the dealerships………
As far as the price, it looks to me like an either / or situation. You can have a $40K Volt in 2010, or a sub $30K Volt in 2011 or 2012. Plus they are learning from companies like Apple. The Iphone came out at almost $600 on day one, and dropped by one third within a few months. If this car has the demand we are telling them it does, they are going to get a premium for the first year’s run. I think the only way that will NOT happen, is if someone else beats them to the starting gate….
A $40K price might drop the number of people willing to place that deposit. Personally, I am a believer, and if the Volt is the car I hope it is, I will more than likely be an early adopter. But I sure would like to see some final specs, “sooner that later”!
January 16th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
[quote comment="27733"]why do i get a feeling that lots of folks on this site would be on the waiting list for hot air or bottled water, if it only had a GM badge on it?[/quote]
Actually, I currently own a Toyota Tacoma quad cab. But I’ll dump it tomorrow if GM gets the Volt right. If not, I’m sure a good on will come from Japan soon enough.
January 16th, 2008 at 6:12 pm
re price: I think it likely that we will have to accept that the promise of 30K is in the context of current prices. If we get a big round of inflation in the next couple of years then the price will go up.
January 16th, 2008 at 6:13 pm
“WN: When do we get to see it?
Boniface: That I can’t tell you. Sooner rather than later. I’ll just say that.”
This is music to my ears!
January 16th, 2008 at 6:18 pm
[quote comment="27825"]re price: I think it likely that we will have to accept that the promise of 30K is in the context of current prices. If we get a big round of inflation in the next couple of years then the price will go up.[/quote]
Don’t forget tax incentives. If the government gives you a $6k tax credit on a $35k car, then the car really costed you $29k.
(I’m only guessing on the numbers, but I wouldn’t be surprised by a $6k tax credit or even more).
January 16th, 2008 at 7:38 pm
I don’t think we should rush Chevy Dealers with money at this stage. We will be having an important Volt community get-together in March in NYC, I am planning it with GM and will let you know the details when they are clear.
We have a waitlist that is growing substantially. The goal will be to connect people to Volts, when the time is right, without price gouging.
January 16th, 2008 at 8:44 pm
[quote comment="27856"]I don’t think we should rush Chevy Dealers with money at this stage. We will be having an important Volt community get-together in March in NYC, I am planning it with GM and will let you know the details when they are clear.
We have a waitlist that is growing substantially. The goal will be to connect people to Volts, when the time is right, without price gouging.[/quote]
I agree, Lyle. And when our waitlist reaches 10,000 (well before the NYC gathering), that will be newsworthy enough to alert several media outlets, which in turn will raise awareness in general to the VOLT as well as to gm-volt.com!
January 16th, 2008 at 9:07 pm
“I don’t think we should rush Chevy Dealers with money at this stage. We will be having an important Volt community get-together in March in NYC, I am planning it with GM and will let you know the details when they are clear.”
…
Ok. I’ll go along with that.
January 17th, 2008 at 8:53 am
This idea to link people to a car that doesn’t exist (even the Tesla was at least available for test drive) is unprecedented. This would be a newsworthy event. I want number 1000.
January 17th, 2008 at 9:44 am
I think GM should start a pre-order program and it could be managed through the local dealerships. I would like to see something like this: 1) A $500 deposit would guarantee a priority placement for Volt delivery. 2) At a price of $30k or less (base model). 3) Ownership of the battery. 4) And… ok, a couple of tee-shirts that say “Future Volt Owner.”
January 20th, 2008 at 4:07 pm
I think the price is high but in the range of “better than ordinary” cars like BMW and the like. For those without this kind of money, there is the ZENN at $12K
February 7th, 2008 at 12:01 am
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